Questions about my Summit 650 resto


 
Thanks Bill....Now your grill is the exact same vintage as mine so your input is very helpful. I tried again today to light the IR but since it was daylight it was hard to see the level of my success. I used a soft I repeat ...soft ....wire brush to sweep across the front of the burner and as debris would start to fall away I would use the shop vac to assist. The burner is much cleaner now but still not flaming on or roaring to blaze orange. Bill, how do u remove the IR burner??? I see the one bolt on the far right.....
I held a lighter against it for 5 min today and I was getting some action but not full ignition. I did clean the crud off of the thermocouple....I thought for sure that would do the trick.
 
Well Larry....I always keep an open mind for your input. It is rarely good news....but sometimes it is on point :) ...well a lot of the times it is on point. So I tinkered on the Summit today. The plan was to fabricate a new heat shield for the rusted cheap metal inner wall of the cook box. Well I was shocked to learn that there is no front on this cook box!!!!! It is crap!!!!!! All the front of the cook box is......is a thin sheet of metal followed by a thin cheap heat shield ...followed by the manifold itself......no thick walled aluminum front to the cook box wall like all of the other grills that we resto. I mean this is complete garbage for such an expensive grill. I am certain they must have improved on this design over the years but my old school Summit is not built like a brick shyyyyyt house. So Larry had a good point ...if that front piece of metal is burned through and rusted it actually could be a little dangerous. I fabricated a piece of metal that was easily twice as thick as the original to cover the rusted panel. It is now twice as fortified as it was originally because the OEM panel is still in place with just a couple of holes in it and my new panel completely covers it. I was able to through bolt my panel so it is strong and isnt gunna budge. I now have the inside all scraped down......the tubes and bars polished.....the new heat shield in place....and the bottom shelf removed. I did reinstall the side burner diffuser and it worked perfectly with the diffuser on. I just need to fabricate a new metal bottom shelf and get that darn IR working and my first and last old school Summit will be out the door. I might just have the buyer sign a " as is " ...use at your own discretion.....waiver but I will be selling this old schooler and not keeping it. I will include pics of the new heat shield. I am lucky enough to be able to keep a lot of scrap sheet metal from work so I have this stuff laying around. I just take my grinder with the cutting wheel and make what I need. Several of the pieces I use already have a nice little bend in them. Bonus....20220620_165322.jpg20220620_165310.jpg20220620_165302.jpg20220620_165254.jpg
 
Yep.....you can pretty much see in my pics.....the cookbox stops way down low. Do you see all those thin strips of beer can metal??? Well thats the area the burners feed through and I guess what you would call the front of a cook box.
Thanks Steve.... nothing fancy here.....just a piece of metal over a piece of metal :)
 
I think Weber's idea was that the slick porcelain would allow grease to run off much more readily than cast aluminum. That's probably true, and many of us have seen where globs of hot grease pooled on the aluminum part of a Genesis firebox. Of course, the porcelain plated steel doesn't last. Weber probably figures that people who are in the league to buy 4 figure grills don't keep them for as many years as some of us. The least they could have done, though, is to stock this component as replacement parts - at least for the length of the warranty period. There is no need to replace an entire firebox. If they worried about liability, they could have required you to have the job done at an authorized Weber dealer.
 
That looks like great work and I have no doubt it's better than new. Just with society the way it is today and everyone lawsuit happy, I am just VERY careful. But you did some nice work there
 
Thanks......and I do appreciate the heads up.
Crazy enough I wouldnt have even seen the holes in the inner front panel if I wasnt alerted to it on this thread. I am always open to learn and improve.
 
Its a flip grill. With every grill I sell and deliver I always take about 20 minutes to go over how the grill works and how to be safe. For this particular grill I will explain the modification that was made and quite possibly write up some kind of disclaimer or something. We have discussed this type of thing in the past but I dont think anyone has started doing it yet.
 
Jim, I am leery about putting some kind of "disclaimer" down on paper. It shows that you have enough knowledge to know that there is the potential of a dangerous situation. Which, in some kind of lawsuit could be held against you. Just stating that you reject any responsibility if it has a nuclear melt down probably won't go far in court. As it stands now, you are just an average guy who cleaned up and fixed up a grill and sold it. You are not some kind of business or expert.
That is just my thinking, but I am not a lawyer and I don't even play one on TV. I don't get paid like one either.
 
I am an accountant - not a lawyer - but I had the same thought that Bruce has. I understand the attempt to protect yourself, but I agree that it could backfire by implying you have doubts about the grill's safety.

I would suggest a Bill of Sale that simply but clearly states that the grill is being sold "AS IS".
 
JimV said:
Well Larry....I always keep an open mind for your input. It is rarely good news....but sometimes it is on point :) ...well a lot of the times it is on point. So I tinkered on the Summit today. The plan was to fabricate a new heat shield for the rusted cheap metal inner wall of the cook box. Well I was shocked to learn that there is no front on this cook box!!!!! It is crap!!!!!! All the front of the cook box is......is a thin sheet of metal followed by a thin cheap heat shield ...followed by the manifold itself......no thick walled aluminum front to the cook box wall like all of the other grills that we resto. I mean this is complete garbage for such an expensive grill. I am certain they must have improved on this design over the years but my old school Summit is not built like a brick shyyyyyt house. So Larry had a good point ...if that front piece of metal is burned through and rusted it actually could be a little dangerous. I fabricated a piece of metal that was easily twice as thick as the original to cover the rusted panel. It is now twice as fortified as it was originally because the OEM panel is still in place with just a couple of holes in it and my new panel completely covers it. I was able to through bolt my panel so it is strong and isnt gunna budge. I now have the inside all scraped down......the tubes and bars polished.....the new heat shield in place....and the bottom shelf removed. I did reinstall the side burner diffuser and it worked perfectly with the diffuser on. I just need to fabricate a new metal bottom shelf and get that darn IR working and my first and last old school Summit will be out the door. I might just have the buyer sign a " as is " ...use at your own discretion.....waiver but I will be selling this old schooler and not keeping it. I will include pics of the new heat shield. I am lucky enough to be able to keep a lot of scrap sheet metal from work so I have this stuff laying around. I just take my grinder with the cutting wheel and make what I need. Several of the pieces I use already have a nice little bend in them. Bonus....View attachment 53459View attachment 53460View attachment 53461View attachment 53462
Click to expand...
You did pretty much what I did, I have access to a brake so I was able to bend it to an exact fit.
 

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Bruce said:
It shows that you have enough knowledge to know that there is the potential of a dangerous situation. Which, in some kind of lawsuit could be held against you. Just stating that you reject any responsibility
Click to expand...
And without it an attorney could show total negligence by doing something without studying possible results in the first place. Having been exposed to more than enough attorney shenanigans in my life there is not total "safe" way, but making sure the buyer has agreed to a hold harmless clause IMO is the "safest". Understand I am not trying to dump water on your parade. You did great work. It's why I don't perform ANY mod on a mixer. I had come up with a number of electrical mods for instance to extend life of older non solid state type machines. Was so proud of myself until this was explained to me. Now, they simply go into the trash for scrap
 
JimV said:
Thanks Bill....Now your grill is the exact same vintage as mine so your input is very helpful. I tried again today to light the IR but since it was daylight it was hard to see the level of my success. I used a soft I repeat ...soft ....wire brush to sweep across the front of the burner and as debris would start to fall away I would use the shop vac to assist. The burner is much cleaner now but still not flaming on or roaring to blaze orange. Bill, how do u remove the IR burner??? I see the one bolt on the far right.....
I held a lighter against it for 5 min today and I was getting some action but not full ignition. I did clean the crud off of the thermocouple....I thought for sure that would do the trick.
Click to expand...
Remove the back cover, disconnect the gas line, remove the cover shielding the igniter and thermocouple, remove the bolts securing the burner to the cookbox.
 
Thanks for the replies guys......always good discussion here. Got my new bottom shelf fabricated and mocked up. Will pre drill and through bolt so it is very strong. All burners are cleaned up and burning perfectly with the exception of the dang IR burner. I still cant get it to light. I will try a trick or two to get it running so I can do a good burn off and let it clean itself. It wont be long before I am putting the doors back on and rolling the ole gal outside for a high temp run. She has come a long wayyyyy20220621_200723.jpg20220621_200713.jpg20220621_203826.jpg
 
Thanks Bill.....I know it seems like the IR should be an easy removal.....its just one of those thing that once I have done one it will be a breeze next time. I am pretty sure the bolts will be corroded and rusty.
 
Bill Pudim said:
You did pretty much what I did, I have access to a brake so I was able to bend it to an exact fit.
Click to expand...
Ya man....that looks first class.....Im just a hack with some scrap metal and a grinder with a cutting wheel. I have to use metal that already has a 90 degree bend on it for projects like this.
 
Did you make that shelf of stainless? Lots of work there If so, maybe you can do a fabrication of a heat shield to repair Summits for folks with Fire Box Burn Through
 
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