Dealership being shady with people who don't know cars...


 
J

JKalchik

TVWBB Emerald Member
Okay, that's about as nicely as I can put it. I'm very specifically leaving out most of the vehicle details.

<grumble> I'm about ready to go scorched earth on a dealership where my g/f has her car serviced. It's now out of warranty, but she's still getting it OEM serviced. Guess I should note that she didn't buy it from this dealership (don't need to go into that here.)

Her last oil change, she as informed that her rear brake pads needs to be replaced, and quickly. I did crawl under it, the pads to my eye didn't look all that bad. But, after looking at the risks involved with the rear calipers, told her to get it done at the dealership.

She brings it in to the dealership, and the tech comes out now and says, well, you really don't need to replace those brakes now, but probably at the next oil change.

Okay, now for the fun..... Today, the tech gave her a measurement of about 40-50% of new. From what I can find online about her specific vehicle, the brake pads are good down to about 20%. So, I'm trying to understand his...... to me, it sounds like she's used about two thirds of the usable pads, with about a third left. Those pads bloomin' well better last her through the next oil change. If that's the case, then these brakes are only good for about 3-4 oil changes, 15,000-20,000 miles. That sounds like complete rubbish.

If she didn't have someone living in her back pocket who does get this stuff, she'd be an easy mark for completely unnecessary service. I'm all for safety (I am rather persnickety about brakes in particular,) but this just reeks of something like fraud. Yes, I'm more than a little frosted over. But, without her say-so, I'm not about to go down to the dealership and start raising a stink.

I need to start making a few phone calls to people I know who are familiar with this make and model.
 
Hard to be totally fair from afar here, but two observations:
1. When a dealership is busy, they do the oil change and move on. When they are slow, they can spend all day "inspecting" the car and looking for things to recommend for service. These things may or not be necessarily/fradulent. Oftentimes, they are doing you a favor by looking over your vehicle.
2. Front brakes are really necessary as they do most of the stopping. Rear brakes are considerably less important and also don't hardly ever need changing.
 
Scott Smith said:
2. Front brakes are really necessary as they do most of the stopping. Rear brakes are considerably less important and also don't hardly ever need changing.
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I'll agree with your first point..... but both writers & techs are usually now under a lot of pressure to sell more service. Don't think I need to put my opinion here about that.

The second part..... that used to be the case. Turns out that on this manufacturer's vehicles, with the automatic brake assist "features", brake bias is rather frequently sent rearward. This leads to a more one to one front to rear replacement, rather than two fronts to one rear set, which has been my rule of thumb.
 
Sounds like she didn't go down for the unnecessary brake service, crisis averted. My favorite one is the $100 cabin air filter change they always push on you.
 
Steve Hoch said:
Sounds like she didn't go down for the unnecessary brake service, crisis averted. My favorite one is the $100 cabin air filter change they always push on you.
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Dealership is still saying replace at next oil change, and to me she should be able to get 2 to 4 times that easily out of her rear brakes. Immediate crisis averted..... sure. Anything beyond you're starting to approach end of life.... that's just plain no. She's still got nearly a third usable pads left. Who's gonna argue against maintaining safety equipment? That's what they're leaning on.
 
Stealerships.

Go independent for non warranty work. Find a good mechanic and get to know them.

Some trucks are under engineered and have excessive brake ware. Some cars too.

Read online for some forums on how to overcome that challenge.

Knowledge is power. You’re in control. Not the stealership.
 
Without knowing the guys at that store, I would imagine it went like this-

Lube tech did a visual and said brakes were needed. Sometimes they are not super familiar with some systems, and advisors are going to sell based on that rec. That's their job. Fortunately the tech that was assigned to do the brakes did the right thing and said they were not needed. As far as the mileage estimate, it's just that. A educated guess. Nowadays some people go 10-15k before changing oil. I always err on the safe side. If I see pads below 20% I let them know. I have no idea when they will be looked at again. Maybe they will hit a quick lube the next couple services and before you know it, it's into the rotor.

At least the actual tech was honest. He could have slammed pads on it and unless she asked to see the old ones that would have been the end of it. Also, i understand you are upset but I wouldn't go down there with the thought of "scorching earth". That very rarely will get you satisfaction in the service department. Good luck.
 
GaryP said:
At least the actual tech was honest.
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Agreed.

I did very specifically ask her to tell the shop that she wanted the old parts left in the car. I should have said that earlier, mea culpa. Might be a good reason that this one said no replacement immediately required.

I've told people for years that when I stop swearing, that's the time to run for the hills. This would absolutely not start with four letter words and raised voices. Asking for a clear and concise explanation of why this was all said over two visits would be the start, with very polite discourse that should pretty clearly indicate they've been caught out. While scorched earth is my desired end result, yeah, that's not the way to start.
 
I have worked for multiple dealerships in multiple locations.
Also very knowledgeable in all departments. Lots can be said.….simple rules here….
Brakes are good to 2mm then it’s time to consider a change soon. Not sure the measurement in inches….
Calipers will fail but you can make them last a lifetime by keeping them clean and lubed.
Newer cars have 4 wheel disc, the rear brakes unfortunately do wear faster than they should…it’s odd.
Rear drums can last 200 miles…..
Best case, find a guy you can trust and make him trust you, always go to him things can be good.
My car is over 68,000 miles and still original brakes around….it’s also very old with rear drums.
 
I do all my own maintenance, but my wife likes the dealership.

She takes her vehicle in every 5k miles for tire rotation and whatever.

However, she calls me as soon as the service person returns with whatever is recommended.

This seems to cut down on the shenanigans.
 
JKalchik said:
Okay, that's about as nicely as I can put it. I'm very specifically leaving out most of the vehicle details.

<grumble> I'm about ready to go scorched earth on a dealership where my g/f has her car serviced. It's now out of warranty, but she's still getting it OEM serviced. Guess I should note that she didn't buy it from this dealership (don't need to go into that here.)

Her last oil change, she as informed that her rear brake pads needs to be replaced, and quickly. I did crawl under it, the pads to my eye didn't look all that bad. But, after looking at the risks involved with the rear calipers, told her to get it done at the dealership.

She brings it in to the dealership, and the tech comes out now and says, well, you really don't need to replace those brakes now, but probably at the next oil change.

Okay, now for the fun..... Today, the tech gave her a measurement of about 40-50% of new. From what I can find online about her specific vehicle, the brake pads are good down to about 20%. So, I'm trying to understand his...... to me, it sounds like she's used about two thirds of the usable pads, with about a third left. Those pads bloomin' well better last her through the next oil change. If that's the case, then these brakes are only good for about 3-4 oil changes, 15,000-20,000 miles. That sounds like complete rubbish.

If she didn't have someone living in her back pocket who does get this stuff, she'd be an easy mark for completely unnecessary service. I'm all for safety (I am rather persnickety about brakes in particular,) but this just reeks of something like fraud. Yes, I'm more than a little frosted over. But, without her say-so, I'm not about to go down to the dealership and start raising a stink.

I need to start making a few phone calls to people I know who are familiar with this make and model.
Click to expand...
Make model year?

I recall one of my ABS 4w disc cars wore out rear brakes faster than the front.
 
I remember having my wife's car in for something a few years ago and they recommended replacing the rear brakes and I declined. She drove it for almost two more years before I had it done and the calipers were still fine. I don't get mad at them for trying, but I pay attention and fix all the little things that go wrong. I draw the line at laying under a car jacked up in the driveway with me underneath it.
 
@Darryl - swazies I'd love to find a good local shop. I thought I'd found one 12 years ago, and had him do a clutch in my old pickup. Found out 2 years later when the transmission lost 5th gear that he'd torqued the pressure plate down wrong and the clutch disc was wearing at a slant. Fortunately, pressure plate and flywheel (all new as part of a South Bend kit,) were just fine, all that really had to be replaced was the disc. He went out of business shortly after (absolutely no activity on my part.) The shop that I'm currently using.... let's just say that I've had some issues there as well.

Oh, and OEM minimum spec on these pads are 1.5mm. She's still got something like 2.5x that.

Honestly, I will not get frosted if you give me an honest appraisal. Then it's on me to make an informed choice.

@DanHoo I'm sorta tryin' to NOT name & shame.... yes, I do have a specific case in the front of my tiny little brain, but I'm hearing about this sort of this far too often, and not just vehicle repair. I don't for a second think that dealerships have the corner on this market. Aftermarket shops are known to prey on people who don't know any better. Appliance repair. General contractors. Trades of all sorts.
 
It's often difficult to make accurate judgements on situations that we encounter without a deep dive. I don't mean to challenge you nor to defend the service center but I'll play devil's advocate: what if the first Tech saw a hairline fracture on one of the pads, or some other deformity or contamination?

If your GF prefers to use this dealer perhaps it could be beneficial at subsequent visits to request that if other service is recommended they show, or explain why it is necessary.

Good luck!
 
BFletcher said:
It's often difficult to make accurate judgements on situations that we encounter without a deep dive. I don't mean to challenge you nor to defend the service center but I'll play devil's advocate: what if the first Tech saw a hairline fracture on one of the pads, or some other deformity or contamination?
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Sure..... but if that's what they saw, then I would expect them to say exactly that. They've only referred to pad thickness, no other issues. If you tell me that the pads are cracked, chipped, wearing unevenly, that's an entirely different ball game, IMO.
 
We've been good with our dealership. They've never recommended unnecessary services (if anything they're a little too conservative there LOL), but they're trustworthy, and when I have had services done they've been the fairest pricing even better than my friend's large chain shop here in Rockford (Butitta Bros) who is a good shop but they charge through the nose. I.E., I needed a timing belt, water pump, all new front oil seals and such along with new drive belts on a 3.0 V6 Toyota I had. My friend's shop was close to $500 higher than the dealer (Anderson Toyota). I could not get an explanation why. But, the dealer has always done well by me. And on the rare occasion they've messed up they stand behind it. Not saying they're perfect but I've been happy enough with them to constantly go back (and I am a former dealer tech). Now the same dealership is very large and sells other brands of cars (Ford, Kia, Hyundai, Dodge/Jeep, Nissan, Mazda) I will never buy those other brands so IDK how the service depts are. I only trade at their Toyota/Lexus store (because they're the only 2 brands I will buy). Not getting into a diatribe on that simply commenting on why their Toyota/Lexus store is my only experience.
Oddly they're good enough even my buddy who lives quite a way from me brings his own vehicles all the way out here from Spring Grove IL to have them serviced here.
Anyway a dealership is only as good as their ownership and the management. Between myself and now my daughter we've bought 6 vehicles from them
 
Our Dog hauler and Home Depot express, it was also Barbs work car until she stopped working is a 2003 Toyota 4runner with 226000 miles on it.
We have a local shop that we take it to, and they have been great and very fair prices. Awhile back I got a mailer from the local Toyota dealer that had just changed hands for a free oil change, so the car was due and I took it there.
Went to pick it up and they had a laundry list of things that were ready to fall apart or cause some other disaster. From brakes to rear seals, rear trans seal, leaking valve covers Etc.
Well I didn't bite and took it over to our local shop and they said it was all BS.
Now two years later none of the issues they brought up has happened. No leaks, no nothing.
Needless to say, I haven't been back to the dealer since.
 
Almost every chain auto service...Firestone,Pep Boys, Goodyear, Midas...
all have their respective "free 32 point inspection" or similar. Dealerships have them too. It's a money grab. I've found that finding an honest, experienced, independent mechanic wherever you live is the way to go.
I'll take our cars to the Lexus dealership only for recall items or in the unlikely event there's a problem with the electronics or navigation(which I rarely use instead of Google Maps).
I also pay my mechanic in cash. It's a win-win.
 
I also have had good luck with my local Honda and Mazda service departments. The Mazda is my wifes car just took that in for an oil change a few weeks ago. I knew it was time for the engine and cabin filter I told the service advisor when I brought it in that I would take care of those items. They went thru the car like they always do and the tech brought up the filters but that was fine. I bought them online for $62 Mazda OEM only I could have used non Mazda filters and saved some money but since I was doing it myself I did not care about saving a few bucks.

All depends on the Dealerships not all of them are bad I had a bad experience with an independent many years ago and ever since then I have the Dealer maintain the car. Does it cost me more most likely but both the ones I go to always have some coupons floating around. The Mazda only has 35k on it for the next 30k it will need just oil changes which are at 7.5k. I handle the cars when it comes to bringing them in for Service I always check the manual before so I know what is needed at the various intervals.
 
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