Why wouldn't you foil?


 
C

Colby R

TVWBB Super Fan
Been smoking for over 2 years now but only few months with the weber and really wondering why anyone wouldn't foil any decent sized meat after the meat isn't taking any more smoke? I've heard the bark argument but mine turns out great regardless and I think it always turns out better and more moist when foiled and the main thing for me is the time ! There is no reason to smoke anything over 10 or 12 hours I had to today simply because I was out of foil and it wasn't the first time and I hated it the finish product I don't think is as good and the time is insane I see people on here smoking we'll over 12 hours and I just wonder why you would when you can have a better product by foiling at the right temp?!
 
So don't anyone get their knickers in a knot because this is just my opinion and the question was asked.

Why I don't foil:

I get just as juicy and tender a product not foiling as I do when I have to use foil. When you foil, especially when adding liquid, you are no longer bbqing you are now braising your meat. The only time I foil is when I'm in a hurry to finish and I rarely find myself in a hurry. Would you put your butt in a pan with liquid and cover it and cook it in the oven for 3-4 hours and then finish it on the BBQ for 2-3 hours to get your smoke flavour and bark? That's basically what your doing when you foil except in a different order.

Let me add there is no right or wrong way but there is your way and my way. To each there own.
 
That's exactly the kind of response skin looking for but I disagree on your thoughts on it being braising your meat the meat only takes smoke the first couple hours this has been proven time and time again because I get same smoke ring and same smoke taste foiled or un foiled but I get much more tender and juicy when I foil it and let it cook in it's own fat and juices
 
Colby, in the end people will use whatever method works for them. There are different reasons why somebody would choose to foil. Time, texture, tenderize, using water in the pan (humidity).. even the amount of marbling in a cut of meat like brisket. I've made great briskets wrapping in foil and butcher paper (separate cooks of course). I also don't really agree with meat not being able to take on smoke past 2 hours.. smoke ring development yes.. but not smoke flavor. Ever had over smoked BBQ? It's very bitter and usually a result of bad fire management/air flow through out the cook.. not just the 1st couple hours. Consider this: The best brisket you'll ever eat at Franklins BBQ never touches foil.. I've had it twice!
 
When guys do things they learn a certain way to do them and they tend to want other guys to agree that they are doing it right. We like being good at something and we like being right. (Just ask my wife).
I hope that someday ( maybe not in my lifetime) the foil people and the no foil people can live in peace. And we can all enjoy good BBQ as one big human family. (Applause-....band plays "he's got the whole world in his hands")
 
Colby R said:
That's exactly the kind of response skin looking for but I disagree on your thoughts on it being braising your meat the meat only takes smoke the first couple hours this has been proven time and time again because I get same smoke ring and same smoke taste foiled or un foiled but I get much more tender and juicy when I foil it and let it cook in it's own fat and juices
Click to expand...

Forget about whether it's braising or not for a minute, and let's just focus on the final product. You asked, so this is my experience. I've tried everything (on the wsm, cheap small offset, and UDS ) and I get a better or just as good overall product without foiling, at least for butts, spares, and briskets...at least most of the time. John brought up the part that fat marbling plays. You gotta keep in mind that when you're dealing with commodity meat, like most of us smoke, that often it can be just too lean, but it doesn't matter what you do. It's going to start drying out before getting fully tender. Foiling will help, but it's not going to magically turn it into great BBQ.

But when I say without foil, I mean just that. NO FOIL. Not even during the rest if I can time the cook right. You just can't argue with this: It doesn't matter how great your bark is when you foil, whether on the cooker or to rest....given enough time and temp, the bark will lose crispness. In other words, if the bark was "perfect" before foiling, do you think it's going to be as crisp and taste the same hours later when you unwrap it? There's always a tradeoff.

Now, back to the overall product, sure I get a little softer texture when foiling, at least for ribs and briskets, but that's not all I'm after. Maybe I'd be more inclined to wrap if I had a stickburner, since there's usually less moisture/more air flow, and a lot more smoke. I'd still lose the bark's crispness, though. But yes, foiling makes things get tender quicker. We pay for it though, not only in softening the bark, but also in some "dilution of smoke flavor". ("Foil diluting smoke flavor" isn't my words. That's Chris Lilly's of Big Bob Gibson...And yes, I know he foils ribs and briskets.) But do I ever wrap? Well, it's basically a tool I'll use, judiciously, if my cook timing is off, either way. I'm with John on the wrapping briskets with butcher paper. You got to try it. Only thing I might wrap in foil even when timing is perfect is loinbacks, since I can only afford the relatively lean ones at the stores. I smoke a LOT more spares.

Anyhow, I've got a question for ya, Colby. When you say you don't notice a difference, have you actually just pulled a butt or brisket off the pit, let it rest on a pan or board (still no foil!) to lose it's steam, then dig into it?
 
Frank H said:
When guys do things they learn a certain way to do them and they tend to want other guys to agree that they are doing it right. We like being good at something and we like being right. (Just ask my wife).
I hope that someday ( maybe not in my lifetime) the foil people and the no foil people can live in peace. And we can all enjoy good BBQ as one big human family. (Applause-....band plays "he's got the whole world in his hands")
Click to expand...

HA!

Kum Ba Ya, my Lord, Kum ba ya.....:eek:
 
Wish I had some good pics to show how great the bark can be with no water in the pan and no foil, but here's some fantastic pork that was cooked with water, but no foil wrap during the cook (or rest), (mainly just tented) and no added finishing sauce after pulling. (My wife probably pulled the foil out. She's always afraid the meat will get cold.) Notice not only how juicy it looks, but at how the bark even looks tender. I've had good, tender, but crisper results with no water. Just haven't taken many pics.



Here's my last butcher paper wrapped brisket. Very tender, and the point fat rendered unusually well. It's way past time to smoke another one.

 
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Bob Sample said:
Would you put your butt in a pan with liquid and cover it and cook it in the oven for 3-4 hours and then finish it on the BBQ for 2-3 hours to get your smoke flavour and bark? That's basically what your doing when you foil except in a different order.
Click to expand...

I would think that would be just as good. Albeit, I would probably want the final stage to be in the pan, as you may have a lump that is falling apart on the grate. I find myself foiling more and more these days just for the tenderness. However, if it takes away anything noticeable from bark, I would reconsider. I have had good success with foil.
 
I have nothing to add other than who cares. Everybody has their own style/technique, if it works for you great, carry on!!!!


I see this thread getting locked and or deleted anyway, the question is when?
 
real good question and thread. am benefitting from all yalls feedback and methods.

i foil any cooks that take longer than 2 hours. so... ribs (baby backs, st louis, spare, beef, etc), chuck roasts, boston butts, whole turkeys, whole chickens, briskets. but I don't foil them for the entire remainder of the cook. i peel open the foil and add more wood for the last half hour or hour so that the wet meat inhales the smoke again. this is just my own method ive developed according to the family's taste and my own. we find these meats to be much more tender and juicy coming from this method.

im with bob, whatever works for any of yall. its personal preference but again ive gained some good knowledge and tips through yalls discussion of this.

thanks-

don't lift the lid...
 
I foil my chuck roasts all the time for pulled beef, if slicing than no foil. Briskets for HH I always foil, butts the same. I used to foil spares, but lately not.:wsm:

Tim
 
Paul Kirk's opinion on the "Texas Crutch". (Read it with a smile)
http://www.baron-of-bbq.com/Texas Crutch.htm
http://www.esquire.com/blogs/food-for-men/bbq-ribs-tin-foil-021711

FWIW, I can taste the difference. It is not to the extent of crock pot vs. foil but there is a difference in texture and a subtle steamed taste when foil is used. It is my understanding that smoke will continue to be adsorbed as long as there is moisture on the surface of the meat.

You prefer foiled due to texture and time. Enjoy!
 
To the comment about it getting locked or deleted .. Why? No ones arguing everyone's having a calm cool collected conversation I still do both ways I simply would rather foil due to time
Constraints
 
Hear, hear ! As long as no ones getting rowdy , I think if people want to discuss something , let it roll.
 
Amen, Frank. I say if you don't like the discussion, don't join the discussion.....or we could just all sing KumbayamaLord again. :)
 
John Segura said:
Consider this: The best brisket you'll ever eat at Franklins BBQ never touches foil.. I've had it twice!
Click to expand...

While I never had the pleasure of tasting his brisket, IIRC he uses Waygu or prime brisket.
Most of us backyard types use choice or select packers. I need to try that butcher paper on my next packer.:wsm:

Tim
 
I have done both and have been back and forth over the years. The general comments are close to what I've experienced -- foiling makes for more tender meat, but not foiling makes for tastier meat. My foiled briskets have made me think "smoky pot roast" where the unfoiled are undeniably "barbecue." I admit that I may not have spent enough time learning to perfect the foiling technique -- my opinion is that timing is everything. I do foil ribs more often than not, but only for a short period of time (20 minutes) to get the brown sugar, apple juice and agave nectar to do their work.

I plan to experiment with setting a brisket in an aluminum pan with no cover to see if I can capture enough juices to add to the sauce. My concern would be that any juice would evaporate. Has anyone done it that way?

Jeff
 
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