Weber needs to make one of these!
- Thread starter Jon Tofte
- Start date
BobH-SCW
TVWBB Pro
Agree it looks like you have a winner there Jon. Price was right and you're results first time out are fantastic! How was the cleanup btw? Looks pretty well designed-I think something like this is right up Webers' alley, could callout a Smokefire kettle? I recall looking at one a few years ago in Sams, was around 200-250, then they just stopped carrying it. Believe it originates in Europe, recall German or Swiss I think. Agree with Lew as well-perhaps they're already designing one behind closed doors?
Joe Anshien
TVWBB Honor Circle
The Spider has great reviews and lots of videos on YouTube. I was very temped to get one but is not really made to fit my Performer.Grilla Grills has the Grilla in a sort-of round kettle-ish style, but it's not cheap. There is also a pellet converter for the Weber kettle, called the Spider 22, but I've never heard too much about it in reviews. Still not as good of a deal as you got Jon.
Thanks Joe. At time I looked at them, quite a while back, I couldn't find much information. Bummer that it won't work on the Performer though.
Brian B Atlanta
TVWBB Gold Member
No I don't think Weber needs to make one of these a Master Touch is 300 bucks so what do you think if Weber made one of these it would cost my guess is probably 600 or more and their are plenty of choices for pellet grills for 320 - 500 if you want a smaller grill. Walmart has a Pit Boss 700 for $317 how good does it work for that money for a first timer who wants to try pellets the reviews are not bad and for those who don't know the founder of Traeger works for their parent company so I doubt its junk.
Weber is going to lose money this year they cannot afford now that they are public to make another mistake on a new product because it better sell and better sell well. Keep making improvements to the SmokeFire but the price is probably hurting that line also sales wise but people with money and who want one they will pay many will not. Traeger has the same issues if you look at their last 2 earnings reports they increased revenue but sold less grills but it gets to the point you just can't keep raising prices my quess is the lower end products like Z or Pit Boss have probably made a fairly large dent in these higher priced pellet grills not much different then the what happened to the gasser market.
The distribution for Weber to me is more of a problem no Smoke Fires to be found anywhere in these chains where Traeger does not have that problem even Costco at least mine, does not even carry the Weber Gassers anymore they feature Kitchen Aid for gassers substantially cheaper than Weber by the way, Traeger for pellets and Masterbuilt 800 which seems to be a new addition in the last few months that is $599 but it was on sale last month for $499.
Weber is going to lose money this year they cannot afford now that they are public to make another mistake on a new product because it better sell and better sell well. Keep making improvements to the SmokeFire but the price is probably hurting that line also sales wise but people with money and who want one they will pay many will not. Traeger has the same issues if you look at their last 2 earnings reports they increased revenue but sold less grills but it gets to the point you just can't keep raising prices my quess is the lower end products like Z or Pit Boss have probably made a fairly large dent in these higher priced pellet grills not much different then the what happened to the gasser market.
The distribution for Weber to me is more of a problem no Smoke Fires to be found anywhere in these chains where Traeger does not have that problem even Costco at least mine, does not even carry the Weber Gassers anymore they feature Kitchen Aid for gassers substantially cheaper than Weber by the way, Traeger for pellets and Masterbuilt 800 which seems to be a new addition in the last few months that is $599 but it was on sale last month for $499.
Jon Tofte
TVWBB 1-Star Olympian
Brian,
I agree with what you are saying about the low-end competition, but there are people willing to pay for better - if it really is better. Also, a pellet kettle that can stoke up some high heat has a different use than a "regular" pellet grill. That's why I don't think Recteq worries a lot about their $399 Bullseye cannibalizing sales from their larger "regular" pellet grills. Recteq tried to push the Bullseye up to $499 but has quickly retreated. It will probably go up at least by $50 again sometimes soon, though. Inflation is a reality for all companies.
So, Weber could probably price a pellet kettle at $479 and still sell plenty. The main thing is that they would be playing on their historic strengths and using a lot of components already in their parts bin. Even more importantly, if stores would carry it, they would be back in the public's eye with a viable pellet grill. No one else would have a pellet kettle in the same stores to compete with it, and a sharply styled one in cool porcelain colors would be an eyecatcher.
I agree with what you are saying about the low-end competition, but there are people willing to pay for better - if it really is better. Also, a pellet kettle that can stoke up some high heat has a different use than a "regular" pellet grill. That's why I don't think Recteq worries a lot about their $399 Bullseye cannibalizing sales from their larger "regular" pellet grills. Recteq tried to push the Bullseye up to $499 but has quickly retreated. It will probably go up at least by $50 again sometimes soon, though. Inflation is a reality for all companies.
So, Weber could probably price a pellet kettle at $479 and still sell plenty. The main thing is that they would be playing on their historic strengths and using a lot of components already in their parts bin. Even more importantly, if stores would carry it, they would be back in the public's eye with a viable pellet grill. No one else would have a pellet kettle in the same stores to compete with it, and a sharply styled one in cool porcelain colors would be an eyecatcher.
Joe Anshien
TVWBB Honor Circle
If I wanted a pellet kettle I would go for a used kettle $50 and a Spider 22 $299 = $350. I want Weber to make a better Masterbuilt Gravity 800. Weber should stay with charcoal IMHO.
Jon Tofte
TVWBB 1-Star Olympian
Joe,
I didn't mean to confine to pellet grills. I absolutely agree with you that a gravity feed charcoal grill is another project Weber very much needs to do and while doing it one up their competition.
I personally think that pellet grills have a place, and like them or not (and I admit I like mine) they are becoming a major piece of the market. I think this would be relatively easy do for Weber.
I have also noticed the Spider which is a very cool idea. Still, it is an adaptation rather than planned from the ground up design. The main drawback I see is that it won't work with Performers. That would be a much better marriage so that you could easily move it around and keep it setup ready to go in your garage when not in use. @Dave in KC showed us how cool that could be with his merger of a Recteq Bullseye and an older SS Performer:
tvwbb.com
I would love to see something very similar but with a Weber porcelain kettle and some really sharp colors!
I didn't mean to confine to pellet grills. I absolutely agree with you that a gravity feed charcoal grill is another project Weber very much needs to do and while doing it one up their competition.
I personally think that pellet grills have a place, and like them or not (and I admit I like mine) they are becoming a major piece of the market. I think this would be relatively easy do for Weber.
I have also noticed the Spider which is a very cool idea. Still, it is an adaptation rather than planned from the ground up design. The main drawback I see is that it won't work with Performers. That would be a much better marriage so that you could easily move it around and keep it setup ready to go in your garage when not in use. @Dave in KC showed us how cool that could be with his merger of a Recteq Bullseye and an older SS Performer:
The WEBteq
I mentioned a few weeks back that the Recteq Bullseye was on sale with free shipping- still is if you are interested. I searched a couple of pages and noticed that it is a nice easy fit directly into a Performer frame. Having a nice spare SSP, the wheels were set in motion. Introducing...
tvwbb.com
I would love to see something very similar but with a Weber porcelain kettle and some really sharp colors!
Joe Anshien
TVWBB Honor Circle
Here is a video of a guy that did mount a Spider 22 to his performer. There is a video in the comments on the right side that shows how he did it. Pretty cool, I like the sliding table, but it is not the way I would have done it. I would have gotten rid of the lid bale, and mounted it on the left.
Brian B Atlanta
TVWBB Gold Member
Most likely even if they wanted to they most likely can't for awhile anyway.
Will We Have to Wait Until 2036 for More Gravity Fed Charcoal Grills? - CookOut News | Grill Business News, Grill Reviews, Grill Releases
Masterbuilt came out with an innovative technology when they released the Gravity Series back in fall 2019. They took all the convenience and versatility that people love about pellet grills and packaged it in a charcoal grill, without sacrificing the charcoal flavor or requiring proprietary...
www.cookoutnews.com
Joe Anshien
TVWBB Honor Circle
Really interesting article and cool video. I'm curious on exactly what the patent covers since there are other gravity fed charcoal smokers (not thermostatically controlled except by add-ons). I was really thinking about buying the 800 when Costco had it on sale a few weeks ago for $550 as I could theoretically replace my performer, wsm, and griddle, freeing up a lot of porch real-estate. My wife was all in favor, but it would be really hard to let go of the performer and wsm, the only Weber I would have left would be the Charcoal Go-Anywhere;-( The other thing holding me back is the performer and wsm can't really break down and no electric required;-)Most likely even if they wanted to they most likely can't for awhile anyway.
Will We Have to Wait Until 2036 for More Gravity Fed Charcoal Grills? - CookOut News | Grill Business News, Grill Reviews, Grill Releases
Masterbuilt came out with an innovative technology when they released the Gravity Series back in fall 2019. They took all the convenience and versatility that people love about pellet grills and packaged it in a charcoal grill, without sacrificing the charcoal flavor or requiring proprietary...www.cookoutnews.com
Brian B Atlanta
TVWBB Gold Member
Joe my guess is whatever it covers it bars entry not sure but is not the whole point its thermostatically controlled designed from the ground up with no need for any add-ons? The 800 was on sale in my store last month for $499 and I expect down the road it will be on sale again. However you mentioned a griddle please be aware the Costco version does not have the griddle and the manifold required for it. You can buy it from Masterbuilt but thats an additional cost.
The funny thing is because it was being discussed I went to the Masterbuilt site yesterday and it said they had a patent so was trying to figure out how the Char-Griller 980 was being sold now we know why they are both owned by the same company so its a mute point.
Kind of in the same boat own a UDS for smoking which will not die and to be honest use that 6 times a year for ribs only and I have a performer which I use quite a bit. The UDS is fuel stingy from what I have read these gravity feeds are not. I have a slow and sear which I need to use on the Performer for ribs and see if that can replace the UDS when it meets its demise which I might before it does.
If I owned a WSM and know many who do that is a tough call which only you can make have to admit and I won't probably ever be a pellet guy but never say never the other thing with the 800 is buy one down the road keep the Performer and you don't need an additional source of fuel you already have the charcoal.
The funny thing is because it was being discussed I went to the Masterbuilt site yesterday and it said they had a patent so was trying to figure out how the Char-Griller 980 was being sold now we know why they are both owned by the same company so its a mute point.
Kind of in the same boat own a UDS for smoking which will not die and to be honest use that 6 times a year for ribs only and I have a performer which I use quite a bit. The UDS is fuel stingy from what I have read these gravity feeds are not. I have a slow and sear which I need to use on the Performer for ribs and see if that can replace the UDS when it meets its demise which I might before it does.
If I owned a WSM and know many who do that is a tough call which only you can make have to admit and I won't probably ever be a pellet guy but never say never the other thing with the 800 is buy one down the road keep the Performer and you don't need an additional source of fuel you already have the charcoal.
Mike - LA
TVWBB Super Fan
Jon I’ll just mention that what you’re asking for is already here. Its been tossed around several times but the Bullseye is the kettle version you seek. I’ve said before I’ve had zero grease problems and been cooking ribs, butts, sausage and everything on mine. It lights quickly and holds set temps very well with very little drop off opening the lid, at least not like my Yoder, it dives. The Aura sear grate is wonderful too. Many mods are available as well as many Weber kettle accessories fit perfectly(rotisserie being one). Lots of YouTube vids. For the complete fanatical brand diehard I think the Weber plastic kettle handles will fit. The treasure you seek is found.
BobH-SCW
TVWBB Pro
In picking up a Spider, all that is required is a cheap base kettle to attach it to, wouldn't need the whole Performer cart and workings. I thought about that route before the wife got me the non-gas Performer with table few years ago. But Dave KC's mod is awesome! I can understand some taking on those projects though with their abilities.. My hats off to them all!
Jon Tofte
TVWBB 1-Star Olympian
Mike and Bob, those are both good observations. I think I have a trade setup to get a uses Bullseye in swap for one of my Weber kettles. Although, I have to say that my first impressions of my off-the-wall Landmann kettle are very positive. I think it may have made the best pork shoulder I have done, at least as good as my former Big Green Egg. I just cleaned it up, and while grease management isn't perfect, it handled back-to-back cooks of burgers and then 14 hours of two pork shoulders with no issue and with a reasonable clean-up time.
I athink the Spider is a worthwhile idea. Personally, I don't like it just attached and anchoring down a kettle, but if it could be made to work on a Performer (preferably a 1st generation SSP) I would be very interested.
My main interest in promoting a Weber kettle is that I would like to see Weber hit a home run in the pellet grill arena. While the SmokeFire has some great attributes it seems even its most loyal owners would admit it has a temperamental streak. I am fine with that myself as long as it delivers. But, retail outlets - and I am afraid too many customers - have sadly crossed it off their lists. Weber needs a pellet kettle that WORKS - and at the same time looks great with Weber style. It just seems so easy. C'mon Weber, let's do this!
p.s. Weber, if you are already working on this idea, I would love to be one of your test evaluators
!!!
I athink the Spider is a worthwhile idea. Personally, I don't like it just attached and anchoring down a kettle, but if it could be made to work on a Performer (preferably a 1st generation SSP) I would be very interested.
My main interest in promoting a Weber kettle is that I would like to see Weber hit a home run in the pellet grill arena. While the SmokeFire has some great attributes it seems even its most loyal owners would admit it has a temperamental streak. I am fine with that myself as long as it delivers. But, retail outlets - and I am afraid too many customers - have sadly crossed it off their lists. Weber needs a pellet kettle that WORKS - and at the same time looks great with Weber style. It just seems so easy. C'mon Weber, let's do this!
p.s. Weber, if you are already working on this idea, I would love to be one of your test evaluators
!!!Brian B Atlanta
TVWBB Gold Member
Bob I guess my question would be not specifically to you or anyone else why not buy a Pitboss 700 at Walmart for $317.00 no kettle needed and it was designed from the ground up the entire unit I mean. The Spider goes to 500 as well as the Pitboss so kind of curious what advantage the Spider really has in this case its not the price. It might have been when they first came out with it.
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Jon Tofte
TVWBB 1-Star Olympian
Brian,
I think one reason is that a pellet kettle with the standard 22" size could allow you to use various grates and accessories (rotisserie?) that a person may already have to use with their charcoal kettle. I already have a sear grate, beer can chicken holder, and even a Wok that would work with a GBS grate on a pellet kettle. A pizza stone and griddle are additional obvious possibilities.
I think one reason is that a pellet kettle with the standard 22" size could allow you to use various grates and accessories (rotisserie?) that a person may already have to use with their charcoal kettle. I already have a sear grate, beer can chicken holder, and even a Wok that would work with a GBS grate on a pellet kettle. A pizza stone and griddle are additional obvious possibilities.
Brian B Atlanta
TVWBB Gold Member
Jon thats a fair enough answer for those that have all that stuff. You love toys surprised you don't have one of these when you feel like using charcoal. Joe had a thread on it a year ago forgot about it.
Brian B Atlanta
TVWBB Gold Member
Joe, Costco has the 800 on sale for $550 until July 13th started on the 30th in case you still have the itch.
Joe Anshien
TVWBB Honor Circle
Thanks - But your sharp eyes saved me. I had not noticed it did not come with the griddle.Joe, Costco has the 800 on sale for $550 until July 13th started on the 30th in case you still have the itch.