So I drove an electric car


 
Holy cow I had no clue Toyota had plug ins that long ago. In any case I've never known anyone unhappy with a Prius.
In any case. I like the more conservative approach they take on them. And if we do go for the BZ4X no one will be "forcing" us as part of a plot :D again it will simply be a more convenient "grocery getter". And, my only reason for putting out was to remark how surprised I was. I was expecting something "weird" but it was a Toyota through and through. I was just pleasantly surprised. Especially because the press has been ragging on it so badly. Shame how they can twist people's opinion even preventing them from doing their own research.
Right now it's a tough choice due to us having a great financial position in the RAV. But if it was totaled tomorrow I'd have no qualms replacing it with the BZ. Anyway time will tell.
Meantime, I'll do something different re my "electrifying" some of my yard tools. Guaranteed to make your hair stand on end :D
 
LMichaels said:
Holy cow I had no clue Toyota had plug ins that long ago. In any case I've never known anyone unhappy with a Prius.
In any case. I like the more conservative approach they take on them. And if we do go for the BZ4X no one will be "forcing" us as part of a plot :D again it will simply be a more convenient "grocery getter". And, my only reason for putting out was to remark how surprised I was. I was expecting something "weird" but it was a Toyota through and through. I was just pleasantly surprised. Especially because the press has been ragging on it so badly. Shame how they can twist people's opinion even preventing them from doing their own research.
Right now it's a tough choice due to us having a great financial position in the RAV. But if it was totaled tomorrow I'd have no qualms replacing it with the BZ. Anyway time will tell.
Meantime, I'll do something different re my "electrifying" some of my yard tools. Guaranteed to make your hair stand on end :D
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I tried the Ryobi 40volt stuff and while generally good their lawnmowers broke all the time and took months to fix if they could even find them after they were shipped out. Sold the stuff and went EGO 56 Volt and very happy. We have a large lawn and when a battery runs out I take that as an opportunity for me and it to rest;-)
 
I've never looked at Ryobi. Not because of any preconceived notion. I just got into the Bosch and DeWalt eco system for my power tools and I have been happy with that.
Still have not pulled the trigger on the BZ4X. Got new numbers and the CFO and I need to do some analytics
 
I don’t know if you’re familiar with Toyota’s stance on BEV, but they have been fighting the push towards all electric and lobbied extensively against the federal push/quotas. They resisted not because they are dominant in hybrids, but because they truly believed that an abrupt shift to BEVs would not be accepted by consumers and charging infrastructure could not be ramped up fast enough. Toyota has been proven correct and all manufacturers are shifting to hybrid as the BEV mandates have been relaxed.

I had an 06 Prius (catalytic converter stolen and donated to charity) and currently have a 20 Prius Prime and just got a 23 Tesla Y. The Tesla takes the drudgery out of driving with autopilot, auto wipers, auto just about everything that can be automated. Tesla is the most efficient BEV and I am averaging 4 miles/kwh over 16k miles. That said, I understand some people don’t want that kind of experience - including my wife who refuses to learn to drive Tesla. The Prius prime goes 25-30m on battery and electric accounts for over 75% of the 25k miles we have on the prime - I bet I could go over 600 miles on a tank.

The BZ and the Subaru Solterra were hedges Toyota quickly produced to satisfy the federal fleet EV mandates. I have never driven one but the reviews are meh - basically drives like a Toyota. The main problem is the range which is only around 200 miles and I suspect the winter range is significantly worse. Tesla has a heat pump and an 8-way octovalve to scavenge heat from all systems to minimize winter range loss whereas just about everyone else still uses resistive cabin and battery heating.

There is a reason BZs are marked down so much. Even if it’s limitations are workable for your needs, the resale value is significantly depressed because there just is no demand.
 
I, too, have read about Toyota being halfheartedly in the BEV space.

I was reading some material today comparing Toyota’s BZ to the Lexus RZ, and while they have a lot of similarities, the Lexus is said to have a Panasonic battery that charges faster than Toyota’s CATL battery, yet with shorter range than the CATL.
 
RC, I think you've totally missed my point on it. I'm not doubting that Tesla has a good BEV. IMO likely the best and most well thought out on market. But, here is the truth. I hate them. They're just over the top "weird". Bottom line, I want a car that drives like a Toyota, feels "at home" like a Toyota.
When I drove the BZ, I INSTANTLY forgot it was BEV. And instead marveled at what a REALLY nice new Toyota it is. One of the biggest reasons I never liked the Prius is because it was "weirded out". Toyota in an effort to separate it from the pack made it spaceship like. And that does not sit well with me.
I can't put my finger on what makes a Toyota drive experience different from others. Maybe because they "out Buick a Buick" or any other old school GM car or older Ford Galaxy.
The Toyota doesn't "alienate" it's driver. Controls "feel" right, they're at hand, they operate like no other with great quality feel. The driving dynamics of the BZ could have been a Camry, or a RAV, or just about anything else.
So I get it. It's not the fastest charging, longest range, fastest 1/4 mile and so on. But it did EXACTLY what I expect from a car (especially a Toyota) it went down the road with a wonderful balance of ride/handling, great acceleration, SUPER quietly as well. WAY quieter than my SIL's Tesla. And it didn't "weird me out". I don't want to be "weirded out". I just want a vehicle that is a high quality "appliance". And all that automation in my SIL's car? Yeah. OK it's cool. But while he was driving me around in his new "joy" showing off the "features" the wipers would not shut off (even though a dry sunny day), on auto pilot it blew right through a 4WAY stop so big even a blind person with no cane would have seen it. (thankfully it was a rural intersection with no traffic). "oh there are still bugs in the software".
Bottom line I don't want all those things especially if they want to kill me :D
I always said I would consider a BEV when one that can be a Toyota comes out. Well it did
 
LMichaels said:
RC, I think you've totally missed my point on it. I'm not doubting that Tesla has a good BEV. IMO likely the best and most well thought out on market. But, here is the truth. I hate them. They're just over the top "weird". Bottom line, I want a car that drives like a Toyota, feels "at home" like a Toyota.
When I drove the BZ, I INSTANTLY forgot it was BEV. And instead marveled at what a REALLY nice new Toyota it is. One of the biggest reasons I never liked the Prius is because it was "weirded out". Toyota in an effort to separate it from the pack made it spaceship like. And that does not sit well with me.
I can't put my finger on what makes a Toyota drive experience different from others. Maybe because they "out Buick a Buick" or any other old school GM car or older Ford Galaxy.
The Toyota doesn't "alienate" it's driver. Controls "feel" right, they're at hand, they operate like no other with great quality feel. The driving dynamics of the BZ could have been a Camry, or a RAV, or just about anything else.
So I get it. It's not the fastest charging, longest range, fastest 1/4 mile and so on. But it did EXACTLY what I expect from a car (especially a Toyota) it went down the road with a wonderful balance of ride/handling, great acceleration, SUPER quietly as well. WAY quieter than my SIL's Tesla. And it didn't "weird me out". I don't want to be "weirded out". I just want a vehicle that is a high quality "appliance". And all that automation in my SIL's car? Yeah. OK it's cool. But while he was driving me around in his new "joy" showing off the "features" the wipers would not shut off (even though a dry sunny day), on auto pilot it blew right through a 4WAY stop so big even a blind person with no cane would have seen it. (thankfully it was a rural intersection with no traffic). "oh there are still bugs in the software".
Bottom line I don't want all those things especially if they want to kill me :D
I always said I would consider a BEV when one that can be a Toyota comes out. Well it did
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Funny - I remember my first Prius a 2005 that I bought used in 2007. The first time I tried backing out of the garage to go to work and I could not get it to move. I had to call a friend who had one and he told me I had to step on the break while pushing the start button;-) Had the car 12 years before I purchased a used 2014 Prius V. I really like getting mid 40 MPGs and the reliability. Having said that, I do like driving my Sienna minivan more as it is a great hauler that drives like a Camry and it has a sunroof.
 
You might look at the Subaru Solterra while you are at it. When I traded my Highlander for the Outback, I found it very familiar with most controls in the same place and functioning the same.
 
JSaus said:
You might look at the Subaru Solterra while you are at it. When I traded my Highlander for the Outback, I found it very familiar with most controls in the same place and functioning the same.
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I would but the local Subaru dealer is :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop:
Worst gang of thieves I've ever come across. And I don't want to do any business (service or sales) at a dealer I can't put trust in
 
I get it - both Priuses drove exactly like regular Toyotas whether in hybrid or EV mode and had similar “compression braking” feel when off pedal. The controls were laid out more or less the same on the steering wheel as Toyota and Lexus (I also own a 2000 Lexus Lx470)

The point I was trying to make is that most people looking for EVs want efficiency, convenience and performance. Since the BZ and Solterra were stopgap measures to hedge against federal EV mandates, their performance and range do not match up with most other EVs in the midsize suv class.

You may get a screaming deal off the lot, but the resale value of BZ and Solterra will always be less than similar. There are many other factors with a lease and maybe you can purchase at end of lease at an even greater deal.

A RAV4 Prime might be ideal for you but they are selling over msrp- my brother in law just got his second and he loves them

Hope this helps
Ray
 
Not feeling the Toyota love....we owned two....an '84 Tercel and an '86 4WD. The tranny went up in the Tercel at ` 100K miles....the head warped on the 4WD at ~ 105K and the fenders in the bed rusted out too.
We follow the maintenance recommendations religiously. Never again.....
 
Rick P said:
Not feeling the Toyota love....we owned two....an '84 Tercel and an '86 4WD. The tranny went up in the Tercel at ` 100K miles....the head warped on the 4WD at ~ 105K and the fenders in the bed rusted out too.
We follow the maintenance recommendations religiously. Never again.....
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Toyota has come a long way since those years, especially in the rust department, but that was true of all the Japanese vehicles. Usually they ran forever, but the fenders fell off along the way. Getting 100K miles on an American car without major repair back then was cause for celebration.
 
I drove a lot of Prius' and honestly hated very one of them. Because they were just plain "weird". They felt weird, looked weird, drove even weirder. Absolutely nothing about them tripped my trigger in any way. Yet drive a RAV4 hybrid back to back with a standard ICE and very hard pressed to tell the difference. Again what I really liked about the BZ. No to very little "weirdness". It felt like driving an RX350, our RAV Hybrid. Controls were all pretty much standard Toyota issue (except for the dial shift) but that I can deal with.
Although all the smart money says don't buy it lease it. Take advantage of the 0% and the $15250 incentive. If you buy t you only get a $2500 incentive and 0% financing. Even the sales manager told me while he'd make more $$$ if we bought, he's known us well and long enough to advise doing the 3yr 12k lease, then purchase for the residual. And when the numbers were run by impartial 3rd party (my SIL) even he admitted that was the best tact to take. Because in the end it saves about $12k over a purchase on the front end.
So all in all it makes sense to me. And right now, while I know Tesla makes an overall better EV, I can't stand them. And when it comes to high tech stuff, I have no faith in Kia/Hyundai, GM, Ford or Chrysler. Which leaves out the new Honda as it's a rebadged GM car.
So if we make the leap I either have to have a car I need to blindfold myself to walk up to and hate being in or, Not make the leap at all.
Any if the Toyota plug in hybrids are in such high demand I would have be at full sticker and wait up 18 mos for it. Though I would like one
 
Sounds like you are making a thorough assessment. Maybe the used BEV market will be even worse at lease end and you get an even better deal.

Not sure who is eligible for rebates right now but don’t forget to consider that

I know people with Hyundai/Kia and Mach-E and they are very happy too

I drove an id4 and that is very conventional and eligible for rebate if I’m not mistaken

Out here in California they were almost giving away the Mirai and including hydrogen fuel credits
 
The Mirai is not sold outside of California. Never saw one. I used to work for a major rental chain. And I saw vehicles from many mfgrs so I learned what has quality and what doesn't. Another reason I'm sticking with who I know and trust.
Nothing signed yet but wife and I have pretty much figured out how to budget for it. While SIL is a Tesla apostle he acknowledges my aversion to them. He said even my daughter doesn't like it either. So then there's that. I guess the apple didn't fall too far from the branch :D
 
So I put a deposit on the BZ and looks like within an hour of listing my Highlander it may very well be sold. But now I have to scramble. Checking with my insurance agent to make sure no horrible surprises and if not then I have to scramble and get that 240v line installed into my garage. I do have a 30amp 110V out there but, I don't think it would be sufficient for our needs
 
I switched from Ford and GM 20 years ago to Toyota and I couldn't be happier. I had become accustomed to issue after issue on Ford and GM Starting immediately after purchasing new Untill Toyota. I'm on my second Toyota in 20 years and I put on a lot of miles. Not one issue in 20 years. Just regular maintenance + tires and battery which I don't skimp on. Tires and Battery is equivalent to grates and flavorizer bars in a grill to me. I don't skimp on them. Resale value is a win also.
 
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When we brought our Highlander in for service they gave us a hybrid Highlander to drive. I HATED IT. No ⚽️ ⚽️

Need to find me a Seqouia in the next couple years.
 
I've been working from home since COVID and will continue to do so. With a new driver in the house, my 14yo Outback 3.6R is becoming less and less available to me. I need a car for local errands, sometimes going to work stuff, running to kids' sporting events and the occasional short trip on weekends. I like the Model Y a lot and I'm a pretty good use case for a BEV. Have driven the Y, but that's the only electric I have driven. I really really liked it, but honestly, it's very basic on the inside. I have no issue with that. The Toyotas are nice, as are some other BEVs, but I think Tesla is ahead in the race. Everyone else will catch up though.

Larry, sounds like you've more than done your homework and have found the right vehicle for your use case and desires. I'm sure you'll love it. Look forward to hearing more about it.
 
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