Ribs: crispy bark?


 
A

Alfred Y

TVWBB Member
Been trying to find a way to get more of a crispy bark on my stl cut ribs.

Been following the recipes here on the "Cooking Topics" .. and it doesn't seem like I can get anything crispy. Just more a of chewy bark.
I've done about 2 cooks so far, both have not been above 300 degrees. I've experimented with both wrapped and unwrapped.

Anyone have any tips? Do I need high heat at some point, with brown sugar somewhere?

Thanks so much, I've learned a lot, but I've got a long ways to go!
 
Maybe you're confusing 'crispy' with 'dry'. Really, bark is the result of your rub caramelizing and then drying out over a period of time. When we think crispy, we think high heat, sear, etc. In this case the opposite is true.

Most rib rubs do use brown sugar or white sugar at some point. Sugar will help with a crust. A good Memphis type rub will get you there. Some folks use mustard as a tack coat, I usually use olive or peanut oil these days. Here are some ideas that can help, YMMV.

Don't overdo the rub, too much can result in goo. You should still be able to see the meat through it when you're done rubbing, think of the coating more as translucent than opaque.
If you're using a water pan pull it for the last hour to let them dry a bit.
If you wrap, remove the foil with an hour to go, but check your rub to make sure it's still there. If gone, sprinkle some more on. This is one of the reasons I no longer foil.
Don't sauce until you serve.
 
I second what TW said. I'm partial to Memphis style ribs. Dry, a lot of flavor complexity, and good bark.
 
We also prefer to sauce ribs on the side. I love the crispiness of the bark, and the flavor of the rub. If I use any sauce, it's a quick dip before chomping.
 
T Waite said:
Maybe you're confusing 'crispy' with 'dry'. Really, bark is the result of your rub caramelizing and then drying out over a period of time. When we think crispy, we think high heat, sear, etc. In this case the opposite is true.

Most rib rubs do use brown sugar or white sugar at some point. Sugar will help with a crust. A good Memphis type rub will get you there. Some folks use mustard as a tack coat, I usually use olive or peanut oil these days. Here are some ideas that can help, YMMV.

Don't overdo the rub, too much can result in goo. You should still be able to see the meat through it when you're done rubbing, think of the coating more as translucent than opaque.
If you're using a water pan pull it for the last hour to let them dry a bit.
If you wrap, remove the foil with an hour to go, but check your rub to make sure it's still there. If gone, sprinkle some more on. This is one of the reasons I no longer foil.
Don't sauce until you serve.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the clarification TW! I'll try the memphis rub and your suggestions to see how well it'll work for me. At the moment, my rub has a good amount of sugar in it already, and I've been using olive oil.
 
Alfred,

Try either peanut or corn oil instead of OO. I know OO is trendy, but it has a low smoke point and it just doesn't "fry" like corn or peanut. My best ribs come when I rub with corn or peanut oil, season liberally with Bad Byron's Butt Rub and cook for about 4 hours at around 275. No foil, no spritz, just indirect heat.
 
Not sure if this is the same chart I posted awhile back or not, but it's handy.
I, and others, were surprised at the high smoke point of light olive oil, the type I prefer due to the mild taste.

[TABLE="width: 514"]
[TR]
[TH]Type of Fat[/TH]
[TH]Smoke Point[/TH]
[TH]Neutral?*[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Safflower Oil[/TD]
[TD]510°F/265°C[/TD]
[TD]Yes[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Rice Bran Oil[/TD]
[TD]490°F/260°C[/TD]
[TD]Yes[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Light/Refined Olive Oil[/TD]
[TD]465°F/240°C[/TD]
[TD]Yes[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Soybean Oil[/TD]
[TD]450°F/230°C[/TD]
[TD]Yes[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Peanut Oil[/TD]
[TD]450°F/230°C[/TD]
[TD]Yes[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Clarified Butter[/TD]
[TD]450°F/230°C[/TD]
[TD]No[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Corn Oil[/TD]
[TD]450°F/230°C[/TD]
[TD]Yes[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Sunflower Oil[/TD]
[TD]440°F/225°C[/TD]
[TD]Yes[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Vegetable Oil[/TD]
[TD]400-450°F/205-230°C[/TD]
[TD]Yes[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Beef Tallow[/TD]
[TD]400°F/250°C[/TD]
[TD]No[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Canola Oil[/TD]
[TD]400°F/205°C[/TD]
[TD]Yes[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Grapeseed Oil[/TD]
[TD]390°F/195°C[/TD]
[TD]Yes[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Lard[/TD]
[TD]370°F/185°C[/TD]
[TD]No[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Avocado Oil (Virgin)[/TD]
[TD]375-400°F/190-205°C[/TD]
[TD]No[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Chicken Fat (Schmaltz)[/TD]
[TD]375°F/190°C[/TD]
[TD]No[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Duck Fat[/TD]
[TD]375°F/190°C[/TD]
[TD]No[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Vegetable Shortening[/TD]
[TD]360°F/180°C[/TD]
[TD]Yes[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Sesame Oil[/TD]
[TD]350-410°F/175-210°C[/TD]
[TD]No[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Butter[/TD]
[TD]350°F/175°C[/TD]
[TD]No[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Coconut Oil[/TD]
[TD]350°F/175°C[/TD]
[TD]No[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Extra-Virgin Olive Oil[/TD]
[TD]325-375°F/165-190°C[/TD]
[TD]No

[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

source:
http://www.seriouseats.com/2014/05/cooking-fats-101-whats-a-smoke-point-and-why-does-it-matter.html
 
Thanks for that, Bob. I use light olive oil for some saute-ing, so it is nice to see that it has such a high smoke point. Maybe I am imagining the better crisping from corn or peanut. Might have to do a side-by-side.
 
But he isn't frying, he's smoking. Odds are his temps aren't getting anywhere close to any of those smoke point. The entire point in using oil is the help get the rub to stick. After several hours in the smoker it's irrelevant.

On July 5th I smoked 20lbs of Butt in the form of 4 smaller cuts. I got up at 3:00 am and in my half-sleep stupor I forgot to put a tack coat on the first one. I did put it on the remaining three. There was absolutely no difference in the flavor or quality of the bark. One thing to remember, it is called 'rub'...so, rub. Don't just sprinkle it on, rub it in. It will stick just fine. About the only plus I can see in using oil at all is that most of the spices in rubs are oil-soluble, which will help things to meld. But I honestly don't know if it even matters after 10 hours or so in the smoker.
 
I suppose my reasoning is that at slightly higher temperatures (275 to 300) you do start sizzling the oil and creating the type of bark on a rack of ribs that the OP first inquired about. I don't think it is irrelevant at all...at least it isn't the way I do it. I've done it with rub only, mustard, light olive oil, peanut oil and corn oil. Peanut yielded the best results, but not enough better than corn oil that I would make a trip to the store to get some. Corn oil came in second, olive oil third and I couldn't tell much difference between mustard and nothing. This comparison is over different cooks, not side-by-side, so the comparison is somewhat skewed, but it is my experience over the last couple years. I get my preferred texture, flavor and color on my ribs when I cook them a little hotter than other people recommend for a little less time than other people recommend and without the foil step that a lot of people recommend. I'm just sharing what works for me.
 
Wait, one post says high smoke point, the other says low for olive oil.

I will definitely try corn oil to see if it makes any difference for me
 
Alfred Y said:
Wait, one post says high smoke point, the other says low for olive oil.

I will definitely try corn oil to see if it makes any difference for me
Click to expand...

Bob Correll corrected my post. Extra Virgin Olive Oil -- the stuff Rachel Ray made famous with her cutesy EVOO acronym -- has a very low smoking point and a very strong flavor that, in my opinion, doesn't complement everything. Get EVOO too hot and you've got a very off-putting smell. Refined or "light" olive oil has a less pronounced flavor and is in line with corn and peanut oil for heat tolerance, which I didn't know --I thought it was higher than EVOO, but still something to be concerned with.

I have a bottle of each on my counter. EVOO is green and used as a finishing/dressing oil. The lighter stuff is pale yellow and starts anything sauteed.
 
Jeff F said:
Bob Correll corrected my post. Extra Virgin Olive Oil -- the stuff Rachel Ray made famous with her cutesy EVOO acronym -- has a very low smoking point and a very strong flavor that, in my opinion, doesn't complement everything. Get EVOO too hot and you've got a very off-putting smell. Refined or "light" olive oil has a less pronounced flavor and is in line with corn and peanut oil for heat tolerance, which I didn't know --I thought it was higher than EVOO, but still something to be concerned with.

I have a bottle of each on my counter. EVOO is green and used as a finishing/dressing oil. The lighter stuff is pale yellow and starts anything sauteed.
Click to expand...

Jeff & anyone who would like to know:

I used vegetable oil, and it was a much better result. Although this contributed to only a fraction of the total experience, I think it made a big difference in getting more of a "crispy" bite in some areas.

I also used a water in the water pan, which helped tremendously with temp control. However, I have mixed feelings about using water as i have yet to do more cooks to confirm what I'm observing.

Thanks everyone, I will be using veggie or corn oil from now on.
 
I've gotten crispy bark by placing the ribs on bottom grate, removing the water pan and maintaining the temp at 350. I think this method comes closest to the way ribs are made in memphis.
 
We like our ribs dry with a nice bark on them so we can taste the flavor of the rub. Like most we put some homemade sauce on the table, but it hardly gets used.
 
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