Scott Foreman
TVWBB Fan
Sweet!! Ought to fit right on! My knees are going to be REAL happy!
New WSMs for 2009
- Thread starter Chris Allingham
- Start date
Sweet!! Ought to fit right on! My knees are going to be REAL happy!
Stuart Osterweil
TVWBB Fan
I must have bad reading comprehension, cause I can't find what are the impovements made to the original size WSM for 09 ?
Thank you,
Thank you,
Jeff Rushe
TVWBB Member
I'm a little late on this one.
Just wanted to give a big "thank you" to Chris and everyone else who posted in this thread for making my day!!
Personally, if that was 99% the design with room for 1 more added feature, I think I'd go with a side access hole for a thermometer/probe.
...or maybe a sturdier access door!
Just wanted to give a big "thank you" to Chris and everyone else who posted in this thread for making my day!!
Personally, if that was 99% the design with room for 1 more added feature, I think I'd go with a side access hole for a thermometer/probe.
...or maybe a sturdier access door!
I had to seam together two pieces of wide aluminum foil to cover the outside of the pan.
I made a brief comment at the beginning of this thread, easily missed:
It is my understanding that many of these features have been rolled into the 18" WSM...thermometer (slightly different design), access door, water pan, charcoal grate, drip pan.
Of course, we now know it's a heat shield, not a drip pan.
I went by Orchard Supply Hardware and looked at an 18" kettle. It does appear to be the same design as the 22" WSM water pan.
Alan D
TVWBB Super Fan
I would have liked to see some type of cart, most all of their products offer more accessories and most have some type of mobile cart/wheels available. Looks like some nice improvements, but nothing earth shattering. Larger, some beefier parts, and a temp that was sorely needed, those are all good things.
At the root of the product, it's a 22 1/2" size of their 18 1/2" product they already had. That doesn't require rocket science to accomplish. In that regard a 14 1/2" sister product seems to make sense, allowing people to select the best size that fits them.
I hope these comments are taken as being constructive and not trying to poo-poo the new model, because I am all for more models, more accessories, and Weber has been better at providing them, more so than any other vendor in this space. It is why folks like me own several of their cookers already, and have used and advocated them.
I'm surprised there aren't any table options yet, tailored for the users. Charcoal cookers have taken a back seat in that regard. Wouldn't it be nice to have a bin to store fuel? How about one that automatically dispenses it into the fire so you didn't have to open and do that yourself? Pellet stoves can do that today...
An honest review would have to say that the folks in the U.K. were able to build a better mouse trap with ProQ, improving on more deficient areas than Weber was able to address in bringing this 22 1/2" model to market. The clips to hold the sections together, additional sections, a more improved door, even a temp before Weber, etc...not to dis Weber on that either, they do have the model being cloned, for the most part. Can't deny that being copied is a statement in itself.
However, Weber has the capability to provide some type of cart, table and/or cooking utensils specific to the WSM, or other features just like folks such as ProQ provide. I guess those type of folks are not eating into Weber's meat yet...
In fact, as an end user, the ProQ series is still attractive if in fact the prices are what folks are tossing around here...more product for less money, with better features. That makes it compelling for me to switch brands.
I think they could have done better, but that's my $0.02. (hope that's not too honest of an opinion;-)
At the root of the product, it's a 22 1/2" size of their 18 1/2" product they already had. That doesn't require rocket science to accomplish. In that regard a 14 1/2" sister product seems to make sense, allowing people to select the best size that fits them.
I hope these comments are taken as being constructive and not trying to poo-poo the new model, because I am all for more models, more accessories, and Weber has been better at providing them, more so than any other vendor in this space. It is why folks like me own several of their cookers already, and have used and advocated them.
I'm surprised there aren't any table options yet, tailored for the users. Charcoal cookers have taken a back seat in that regard. Wouldn't it be nice to have a bin to store fuel? How about one that automatically dispenses it into the fire so you didn't have to open and do that yourself? Pellet stoves can do that today...
An honest review would have to say that the folks in the U.K. were able to build a better mouse trap with ProQ, improving on more deficient areas than Weber was able to address in bringing this 22 1/2" model to market. The clips to hold the sections together, additional sections, a more improved door, even a temp before Weber, etc...not to dis Weber on that either, they do have the model being cloned, for the most part. Can't deny that being copied is a statement in itself.
However, Weber has the capability to provide some type of cart, table and/or cooking utensils specific to the WSM, or other features just like folks such as ProQ provide. I guess those type of folks are not eating into Weber's meat yet...
In fact, as an end user, the ProQ series is still attractive if in fact the prices are what folks are tossing around here...more product for less money, with better features. That makes it compelling for me to switch brands.
I think they could have done better, but that's my $0.02. (hope that's not too honest of an opinion;-)
Honest opinions are always welcome.
I agree with you, Alan, that the biggest improvement is the 22" size. You can mod your current WSM 'til the cows come home, but you can't give it a bigger diameter. It's not rocket science, but it does suggest that Weber is taking its investment in this product line more seriously than in the past 25 years, and that's a good thing. Given that it sounds like they're also bringing the 27" kettle grill back, I hope they will keep the spotlight on charcoal products and improvements for a while.
Regarding the ProQ, I've not used one, so I cannot speak authoritatively about it. I have only seen the video from the Illinois BBQ Society that compared the WSM with the big ProQ. You cited the clips and door as positives...not sure I agree about the clips, and the door is very small. Hinging it is fine, but we'll see how it holds up over time with use. Weber now has a clever door design that keeps it attached to the cooker or it can be removed. It also has a large, plastic handle that can be operated without gloves. In terms of fit, it's my understanding that Weber will continue to work on improving this...we'll see.
The only ProQ accessory I see that is interesting is the meat hanger. Everything else I see on their site is available elsewhere. From a practical standpoint, I don't understand how you're supposed to place the hooked meat on the rod or remove the hooks from the rod. Does one person hold the lid up in mid-air while another person hangs the meat? Seems like the barrel smokers are better at this...set the lid aside and the rod is hanging across the top of the barrel.
Another point of comparison is the finish. We know how the Weber porcelain enamel coating holds up over time. We don't know how the ProQ painted finish will do. Time will tell. We also have a lot of experience with great Weber customer support.
Again, good discussion! Let's hope this is not the end of Weber's investment in smokers, but just the beginning. I wouldn't have believed that a few months ago, but now, who knows? We'll see.
Best,
Chris
I agree with you, Alan, that the biggest improvement is the 22" size. You can mod your current WSM 'til the cows come home, but you can't give it a bigger diameter. It's not rocket science, but it does suggest that Weber is taking its investment in this product line more seriously than in the past 25 years, and that's a good thing. Given that it sounds like they're also bringing the 27" kettle grill back, I hope they will keep the spotlight on charcoal products and improvements for a while.
Regarding the ProQ, I've not used one, so I cannot speak authoritatively about it. I have only seen the video from the Illinois BBQ Society that compared the WSM with the big ProQ. You cited the clips and door as positives...not sure I agree about the clips, and the door is very small. Hinging it is fine, but we'll see how it holds up over time with use. Weber now has a clever door design that keeps it attached to the cooker or it can be removed. It also has a large, plastic handle that can be operated without gloves. In terms of fit, it's my understanding that Weber will continue to work on improving this...we'll see.
The only ProQ accessory I see that is interesting is the meat hanger. Everything else I see on their site is available elsewhere. From a practical standpoint, I don't understand how you're supposed to place the hooked meat on the rod or remove the hooks from the rod. Does one person hold the lid up in mid-air while another person hangs the meat? Seems like the barrel smokers are better at this...set the lid aside and the rod is hanging across the top of the barrel.
Another point of comparison is the finish. We know how the Weber porcelain enamel coating holds up over time. We don't know how the ProQ painted finish will do. Time will tell. We also have a lot of experience with great Weber customer support.
Again, good discussion! Let's hope this is not the end of Weber's investment in smokers, but just the beginning. I wouldn't have believed that a few months ago, but now, who knows? We'll see.
Best,
Chris
George Curtis
TVWBB Olympian
weber did what we asked in a way that is keeping the price reasonable. most extra stuff can be added easily like the handles. i would rather buy it cheaper and add than buy it with all kinds of stuff that i didn't want/need and pay alot more. no matter what, i imagine that their sales on this will be limited and they know this. as to the 26 in kettle, i think that will be a great addition to many of us. thank you weber.
Alan D
TVWBB Super Fan
Chris,
I think I agree with most of what you say. I have not used the ProQ either, and have only seen comparisons on the web. It looks like a well thought out product, and they have the eyelets I believe, for the probes.
I agree you can mod the 18 1/2" WSM til the cows come home but will never be larger. ProQ has done that with a 20" already, and can do a 24" if they wanted to...if size is really the bottle neck. I realize for many of the folks here it is, but I am just a 'que aficionado, not really looking to compete with my food. I just do it for family and friends.
I only would want the clips when I transport the smoker, it seems safer to me to have it closed up tight. Maybe that style clip could be improved upon, but the point is that ProQ did offer that on their units as a value add.
Weber was able to reuse more parts and/or assembly techniques they have in place, more power to them.
Mostly I wanted to point out that there is still a lot of value that Weber can offer to their customers, to make their experience better, and they didn't address too many of those points on this product.
With all that said, I am 100 percent in agreement with you about this product and the 26" kettle as being examples that Weber is taking their traditional product line more seriously and offering these products is a good thing.
I agree about the porcelain paint, I have a 25 year old kettle that proves it. Still cleans up nicely, although the handle is not great, it still has the original handle and I know Weber sells them. I'm on my 3rd grill, 2nd coal grate, and 2nd ash tray. I would have bought wheels from them, but nobody had them in stock so I got my own cap nuts and fixed the old ones. Also have bought 2 tables, and while both are gone/destroyed from time/elements, I could buy another one if I want.
I'd like to see some accessories for the WSM(s).
I think I agree with most of what you say. I have not used the ProQ either, and have only seen comparisons on the web. It looks like a well thought out product, and they have the eyelets I believe, for the probes.
I agree you can mod the 18 1/2" WSM til the cows come home but will never be larger. ProQ has done that with a 20" already, and can do a 24" if they wanted to...if size is really the bottle neck. I realize for many of the folks here it is, but I am just a 'que aficionado, not really looking to compete with my food. I just do it for family and friends.
I only would want the clips when I transport the smoker, it seems safer to me to have it closed up tight. Maybe that style clip could be improved upon, but the point is that ProQ did offer that on their units as a value add.
Weber was able to reuse more parts and/or assembly techniques they have in place, more power to them.
Mostly I wanted to point out that there is still a lot of value that Weber can offer to their customers, to make their experience better, and they didn't address too many of those points on this product.
With all that said, I am 100 percent in agreement with you about this product and the 26" kettle as being examples that Weber is taking their traditional product line more seriously and offering these products is a good thing.
I agree about the porcelain paint, I have a 25 year old kettle that proves it. Still cleans up nicely, although the handle is not great, it still has the original handle and I know Weber sells them. I'm on my 3rd grill, 2nd coal grate, and 2nd ash tray. I would have bought wheels from them, but nobody had them in stock so I got my own cap nuts and fixed the old ones. Also have bought 2 tables, and while both are gone/destroyed from time/elements, I could buy another one if I want.
I'd like to see some accessories for the WSM(s).
As I said in the ProQ thread elsewhere, kudos to them for moving the ball forward with new, innovative features. That's a great thing for the entire smoker segment.
I'm not convinced that transport and clips are important for most people. It may help for competitors that transport their smokers a lot, but they are not the majority.
The probe eyelet would be a nice touch, I agree.
Like you, I have 25 years of experience with Weber products. Their quality stacks up well against anyone. I always feel sorry when I'm shopping at Target or Walmart and see people purchasing cheap Chinese grills...they'll be back for another one in a few years.
Regards,
Chris
I'm not convinced that transport and clips are important for most people. It may help for competitors that transport their smokers a lot, but they are not the majority.
The probe eyelet would be a nice touch, I agree.
Like you, I have 25 years of experience with Weber products. Their quality stacks up well against anyone. I always feel sorry when I'm shopping at Target or Walmart and see people purchasing cheap Chinese grills...they'll be back for another one in a few years.
Regards,
Chris
I always feel sorry when I'm shopping at Target or Walmart and see people purchasing cheap Chinese grills...they'll be back for another one in a few years.
Isn't that the point? That's how Brinkmann became the world's largest bbq smoker manufacturer. Their stuff only lasts for about 2 seasons so they have a great revenue cycle with repeat customers.
Mikey Seim
TVWBB Member
In some ways I'm not surprised by all this. After all, I finally bought my WSM this spring, so OF COURSE they are finally going to put in some major upgrades. But it's OK, I still like mine.
I'm just glad to see Weber is investing the money they're making off the new gas grill lines and rolling it into the charcoal grills. Of course, I've read that charcoal grill sales are up dramatically over the last few years (second grills, "weekend" grills, etc.), so it's also smart business. Lack of investment in future products is a bad sign from any company.
Will Weber's 22" rotisserie mate up with the 22" WSM?
I'm just glad to see Weber is investing the money they're making off the new gas grill lines and rolling it into the charcoal grills. Of course, I've read that charcoal grill sales are up dramatically over the last few years (second grills, "weekend" grills, etc.), so it's also smart business. Lack of investment in future products is a bad sign from any company.
Will Weber's 22" rotisserie mate up with the 22" WSM?
Chris,
I totally agree with you. I got my first smoker, an ECB Deluxe as a b-day gift about 5 years ago and after using it 4 times I threw it under the deck to rot. After I got my WSM back in February I dug the ECB out and put it in the trash becuase I didn't want the WSM to see it.
I'm thrilled that Weber is taking a renewed interest in their charcoal line. I think sites like yours have a lot to do with that.
I totally agree with you. I got my first smoker, an ECB Deluxe as a b-day gift about 5 years ago and after using it 4 times I threw it under the deck to rot. After I got my WSM back in February I dug the ECB out and put it in the trash becuase I didn't want the WSM to see it.
I'm thrilled that Weber is taking a renewed interest in their charcoal line. I think sites like yours have a lot to do with that.
Chris,
Although the New WSM is much taller than Classic WSM, from the side-by-side views it appears that the space between the grates remains nearly the same (this is probably covered in one of your 4 videos, but I, inexplicably, found watching Misty and Keri more compelling viewing last night). It appears to me that about two inches of lower grate headroom is gained with the Jumbo-WSM. Since the grate spacing hasn't changed much, the extra height appears mostly below the lower grate.
I'll be very interested to see the results of your capacity tests. I suspect 8 butts or 4 butts over 2 briskets will fit easily on this smoker. You may even be able to fit a turkey on each level. With grill expanders (a BGE accessory) 4 levels of ribs may be achievable.
Weber did an outstanding job with that over-sized access door. Your picture shows that the water pan can be refilled through the door and charcoal easily added to all areas of the charcoal bowl without removing the center ring. The access door may even function as a "coal chute" when more fuel is needed. With this enhanced access door, I don't understand why handles would be needed or even desired on the center ring.
I suspect that the extra space between the fuel and the cooking grates may affect the temperature characteristics of the Jumbo WSM. I'm curious as to how the upper-lower grate temperature gradient will change. This temperature difference may be lessened by the additional distance from the fuel.
This extra height may also allow waterless smoking without sand or a Piedmont Pan since the lower rack is so much further from the fire.
I'm looking forward to your test reports.
Although the New WSM is much taller than Classic WSM, from the side-by-side views it appears that the space between the grates remains nearly the same (this is probably covered in one of your 4 videos, but I, inexplicably, found watching Misty and Keri more compelling viewing last night). It appears to me that about two inches of lower grate headroom is gained with the Jumbo-WSM. Since the grate spacing hasn't changed much, the extra height appears mostly below the lower grate.
I'll be very interested to see the results of your capacity tests. I suspect 8 butts or 4 butts over 2 briskets will fit easily on this smoker. You may even be able to fit a turkey on each level. With grill expanders (a BGE accessory) 4 levels of ribs may be achievable.
Weber did an outstanding job with that over-sized access door. Your picture shows that the water pan can be refilled through the door and charcoal easily added to all areas of the charcoal bowl without removing the center ring. The access door may even function as a "coal chute" when more fuel is needed. With this enhanced access door, I don't understand why handles would be needed or even desired on the center ring.
I suspect that the extra space between the fuel and the cooking grates may affect the temperature characteristics of the Jumbo WSM. I'm curious as to how the upper-lower grate temperature gradient will change. This temperature difference may be lessened by the additional distance from the fuel.
This extra height may also allow waterless smoking without sand or a Piedmont Pan since the lower rack is so much further from the fire.
I'm looking forward to your test reports.
i want handles because it is far easier to remove the food with the center section and tend the coals without getting charcoal dust and ash all over what your trying to cook. its just a pain int he butt in a major way to tend the thing through a door. i dont thin it matter how big the door is when it stirs the ash and coats the food like pompeii part 2