Is the Weber Summit Charcoal a flop?


 
R

Robert Dilbert

TVWBB Fan
I have no doubt that it is a fantastic grilling machine, but I have never even seen one in real life. Around my grilling circle of friends no one talks about it. On the internet no one talks about it. There was a little buzz when it came out but all is silent now. I see and hear of plenty of kettles, WSMs, BGEs, Komodo Joes, Ugly drums, Weber gassers, Pellet Poopers, you name it, but it’s almost like the Charcoal Summit is non-existent. Did they price themselves out?
 
The only places I know of in KC that sell them are high-end grill stores.
This is for an extremely small niche market. I question why anyone in their
right mind would pony up $2k for a charcoal grill, but I don't have $$ falling
out of my keester either, so I am obviously not Weber's targeted buyer anyway.
 
Dave in KC said:
This is for an extremely small niche market.
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Is it really though? I see and know of many people who have BGEs with all the side tables and accessories, and really the summit charcoal is right around the same price range. but i agree, i am not plopping down $2k for any grill.
 
If money were no object I'd have one. Plenty of people spend that or more on charcoal grills. It's not as ridiculously out of reach as something like a Komodo Kamado. I think maybe "flop" is a little harsh, but I doubt they sold as many as they wanted. Maybe that's not the goal.
 
I wonder how many people really know about them. I've never seen one in the big box stores such as Lowe's, Home Depot, Walmart, and so on.

The only time I ever saw one on display was at a Green Acres garden store. They are one of the "authorized" Weber dealers around here. But not a place many people would think to go looking for a grill. I imagine a lot of people don't know that Weber even makes such a thing. The marketing seemed almost non existent for them. I would think if the Lowe's and Home Depot's type stores had a row of them on display they may have been more successful.
 
I personally feel that Weber made a very nice product but priced it not based on their cost to manufacture but what a similar Big Green Egg/Primo/etc. kamado grill would fetch. One of those will last a lifetime whereas a steel grill is much less likely to do so.

If they had been more aggressive in pricing and worked harder to get it into more retail locations, it might have been a winner for them. I do have to think that the Summit Charcoal may have had some influence on Weber's pricing for the SmokeFire which, as I have posted about, is very competitive - actually better - than their comparable competition from Traeger.

So, I guess the Summit Charcoal is not a flop in terms of how well it works, but I doubt it has made Weber much money.
 
Jon, I agree it was most likely a great product that needed to priced more aggressively. Pretty hard for big box stores to inventory something at that price level especially being charcoal if they are carrying the Kamado type smokers also. I think the thing is absolutely beautiful but to pony up that kind of money its just tough for the masses. How much could it cost as you stated to make that thing so maybe they did not lose any money but maybe they diverted resources for little volume that could have been used elsewhere or just sell the thing for a more reasonable price.

I agree maybe they learned by pricing the SmokeFire aggressively instead of putting it into Yoder territory. They are also late to the game so that has to play a part in it but at least they have Lowe's carrying it and I don't believe they ever carried the Summit maybe ship to store where they have no risk as you pay up front. Pretty good guess Lowe's took their pricing into consideration when deciding to carry the SmokeFire.
 
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They sure are pretty and as much as I'd love to have one, I just don't know how much I would use it. It does the same things that my Performer Kettle and my 22.5" WSM does, except it doesn't hold as much food as my WSM and is probably a little more complicated to use than my Performer Kettle. Just my assessment without having used one. Then you consider the price, and it's just not something this Weber man is looking to add to the collection. If I'm going to spend that kind of money now, I'm getting a new SmokeFire or a Ranch Kettle.
 
I don't think it is a flop, but I agree that it is priced about $200 to $300 too high at the moment. I think this has a lot to do with the fact that they wanted to have an offering (and a superior one in my opinion) to other kamado style grills. Pricing them cheaper really isn't something that will help them out that much though because it will almost certainly take away sales from their 26er and even their 22 while being more difficult to produce and likely having a much longer service life.

I mean most people that do get them have little temptation to buy another weber grill or smoker because the summit charcoal is kind of a year around swiss army knife of a cooker. If they aren't a collector then really all they need is a 22 inch kettle to be able to use random accessories or a Ranch if they throw big parties.

So lets say you buy a WSM for $400, a 26er for $330, and a MT for $200. All of a sudden you are over $900 in grills/smokers and they will be less efficient with charcoal and be much more difficult to use in cold cooks. You price the non table Summit around say $1,000 to $1,200 and all of a sudden you have people making that buy instead of the others. I would bet the profit margin on the 3 grills is better or comparable to the non table Summit at $1,500. There just really isn't an incentive for them to be more competitive on price until the kamodo style grills start taking a bigger piece of the grill pie.
 
As most here have commented, way over priced. And it seems that Weber does not agree and continue to keep it over priced. But hey, they've got the numbers on whether it provides a profit in their product line. But I will never buy one.
 
Brian B Atlanta said:
A ranch new is $1,425 don't get that either. Buy a couple of 26's and have $800 in your pocket if you needed that kind of space.
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There are a few things that really drive up the price of the Ranch:

1.) There is a lot of material in making the thing given its size.
2.) It is actually rolled steel instead of stamped steel like all of their other products so the manufacturing cost is higher.
3.) The top grate is made with 304 stainless steel rather than an inferior metal.

I wouldn't pay $1,425 for one either, but I completely understand the price tag after getting up close and personal with mine that I bought used. There are some advantages to using a Ranch over a 26 as well when it comes to cooking large quantities of food. It is simply the king of zone cooking given its size, you have the ability to cook multiple large items at once like whole chickens, and when you need to move a lot of food from the hot to cold side the grate is super easy to spin. It just depends on how many you are cooking for.

I wouldn't recommend paying $1,425 for one, but if you had an opportunity to pick up one in good condition for say $750ish or less and you had the room I would tell you to load it up!
 
A large part of the reason for the pricing of the Ranch and the Summit Charcoa, is they are attractive to a very small market. They can't get economy of scale in manufacturing to lower the price.

I would be interesting in knowing how Weber accounts for each product line, whether they're willing to suffer a loss on certain products just to offer that product.
 
Didn't Weber get bought by some venture capital outfit a few years back? Makes me wonder if the charcoal Summit would've happened if that deal and any subsequent business model changes hadn't happened.
 
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Jon Tofte said:
I personally feel that Weber made a very nice product but priced it not based on their cost to manufacture but what a similar Big Green Egg/Primo/etc. kamado grill would fetch.

So, I guess the Summit Charcoal is not a flop in terms of how well it works, but I doubt it has made Weber much money.
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Bolded is my assumption also. i have never used one, but i would assume its not a flop on how well it works, but the sales and buzz around it seems non-existant, thats a flop to me. Again, BGEs, pellep poopers etc are everywhere, summit charcoals are not
 
Brad Olson said:
Didn't Weber get bought by some venture capital outfit a few years back? Makes me wonder if the charcoal Summit would've happened if that deal and any subsequent business model changes hadn't happened.
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Brad, BDT Capital Partners LLC bought a majority stake in Weber 2010.
 
Brad Olson said:
Didn't Weber get bought by some venture capital outfit a few years back? Makes me wonder if the charcoal Summit would've happened if that deal and any subsequent business model changes hadn't happened.
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Yes and it seems they’re learning that if they cut corners and create crap products they will suffer a la spirit negative reviews so they’re turning it around.

But to OPs point I think Weber has fried a few niche products not worth the venture. If I want a kamado I don’t need it to be a Weber
 
It may be a good product, but I don't think its a sales success. its supposed to be Weber's version of the BGE, at the pricing of the BGE. However, i don't think it ever got the cool factor that the BGE enjoys, the Weber doesn't have any buzz and honestly it needs it to sell at these kind of prices.

I find the Summit charcoal more appealing than a BGE and it would be cool to have, but I was never in the market for a BGE and spending that kind of pricing for it. Frankly it would have been nice at twice the price of an 18" WSM or performer as I could see it replacing both of those. I could honestly see myself with just a Summit stand alone (not grill center) as an alternative. But A) I have the WSM and Performer, and B) I haven't been using charcoal enough lately to the point of contemplating getting rid of the performer, to not have it rot in my yard.

I also do think its a market they should be in. However, I think that the price points are just an excessive jump from their normal charcoal line. $329 for a 26", $439 for a performer to $1499 the the Summit. Its a 3x+ jump to get to teh Summit line. What that tells me in my uneducated guessing, is that they're not looking for people to be upsold at all. They're going after a completely different class of customer.
 
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I was excited when they came out but immediately thought why pay that much when you could get a performer.
 
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I would love to have one, but... I would be too worried about Weber supporting it over the long term. It is a high-end unicorn. Weber's track record of supporting its top-line equipment is not good.

If I hit the lotto tonight would I spring for one? Sure, and a Smokefire, and an old Genesis Platinum Stainless Steel, and maybe even a new summit gasser, too. :D
 
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