High wind warning

[John G (Boston)]

Yesterday I put my new extra cheap cover from Amazon on the spirit 700 and secured it tightly with the drawstrings at the bottom
Found it in the bushes this morning
Probably a bad choice, better to get a free one with a donor grill.
Grill didn't move, probably lucky the cover went.

Yup, last wind storm we had - I did not tie the grill down - the cover blew off and was headed for the neighbor. I spotted it mid-storm and went out to get it. I had the same feeling - "good thing the cover blew off and not the whole grill". Bruce is right. Full sails up when you have a cover

 

[Ed L]

Out of curiosity.

With these extremely cold temps.

How are you keeping warm?

Woodstove, natural gas, oil, propane, electric, fireplace?

Ed

 

[TomRc]

Out of curiosity.

With these extremely cold temps.

How are you keeping warm?

Woodstove, natural gas, oil, propane, electric, fireplace?

Ed

We are in our 4th winter with 100% air source heat pump heating & cooling units. 7 ductless split heads running on 3 outdoor units. Current temps are +3 / -9 (wind chill).

 

[Bruce]

LP Gas and just basically staying home as much as possible and not going out more than necessary.

 

[JKalchik]

Out of curiosity.

With these extremely cold temps.

How are you keeping warm?

Woodstove, natural gas, oil, propane, electric, fireplace?

Ed

A reasonably well insulated house, new windows (2 years old,) and a high efficiency natural gas furnace. I've apparently finally got the whole house humidifier dialed in right, while there is some condensation on the windows this morning at -5 F, it's only about an inch & a half around the edge (and most of it isn't frozen.)

Honestly, this cold snap is a real problem for people who just are not sufficiently prepared for it.

 

[Jon Tofte]

We are in our 4th winter with 100% air source heat pump heating & cooling units. 7 ductless split heads running on 3 outdoor units. Current temps are +3 / -9 (wind chill).

Tom,

We have a very old heat pump with secondary electric unit that has been having to kick in a lot the last few subzero days. When that thing is on I rapidly reach the threshold of being added to the board of directors of Duke Energy .

We have a ductless split setup on order to replace our aging forced air system. I admit that I am very nervous about it, but our HVAC company assured me it is the wave of the future and that with our miserable design split level house the ideal solution.

It sounds like you are happy with yours. Any additional feedback?

 

[TomRc]

Tom,

We have a very old heat pump with secondary electric unit that has been having to kick in a lot the last few subzero days. When that thing is on I rapidly reach the threshold of being added to the board of directors of Duke Energy .

We have a ductless split setup on order to replace our aging forced air system. I admit that I am very nervous about it, but our HVAC company assured me it is the wave of the future and that with our miserable design split level house the ideal solution.

It sounds like you are happy with yours. Any additional feedback?

Here’s my #1 thought on the subject...Don’t do it half-a$$ed if you’re going to do.

Here’s my 2 cents on how to do it right...
1. Start with “Max Heat” or equivalent outdoor units. If the system you are considering can’t provide 100% of the unit’s rated output at 0 degrees, then find another system.
2. Buy a comprehensive system or expect to rely on secondary or backup heat methods. Ductless split heads are essentially a “point of use” item since the circulation of air is largely limited to the room in which the head is located in. You can’t expect a single head or two to heat an entire home without having cold spots or pocketed heat. In our case, we have one head in each bedroom, one in each of the primary living areas, and one in the basement for a balanced and comfortable conditioned space. We went this route because the home does not have any existing ductwork.

Your old heat pump with electric backup is a dinosaur compared to modern ASHP systems and your utility surely thanks you for that as temperatures drop. Depending on the age of your system, it may be relying 100% on those electric resistive heat strips as soon as the outdoor temps reach the low teens or high single digits.

If it is not the direction you are already going, you might want to consider a matched inverter heat pump / air handler combo to replace your system which will re-use your existing ductwork and offer a whole home solution. I do CAD drawings and design heating / cooling systems for my primary occupation and have laid out a lot of Samsung inverter air handler and Bosch Bova 2.0 inverter heat pump systems for use here in the northeast of late. I won’t tout one brand name above another in this category. My relationships just happen to be with the 2 brands mentioned here.

The utility companies are really driving this segment of the market through rebates and conversion incentives. Additionally, the federal government is expected to announced their own incentive programs sometime during the first quarter of 2023 as well if things go as anticipated.

 

[Jay D in Jersey]

Replaced our 10 year old Carrier furnace 11 months ago. It was less than 10 years old. I specifically requested a single stage Payne gas furnace. Not as efficient but far less complicated and fewer components to fail. Carrier did honor the warranty on the failed secondary heat exchanger. There was a $500 or $800 credit towards the Payne.
Replaced the furnace and AC in the beach house this past October²...it was a 24 year old Bryant...that still worked for heat but the AC was starting to struggle. Have had decent service life out of Carrier products. Neither furnace is the top of the line in terms of efficiency...but they are solid and reliable and function great with their respective WiFi thermostats....a simple Honeywell at the beach house and an Ecobee in our primary home here 35 miles West of Philly. I'm holding 39% humidity when it's 3 degrees outside. No humidifier at the beach house...not really needed with the bay across the street.

 

[Jon Tofte]

I’m

Here’s my #1 thought on the subject...Don’t do it half-a$$ed if you’re going to do.

Here’s my 2 cents on how to do it right...
1. Start with “Max Heat” or equivalent outdoor units. If the system you are considering can’t provide 100% of the unit’s rated output at 0 degrees, then find another system.
2. Buy a comprehensive system or expect to rely on secondary or backup heat methods. Ductless split heads are essentially a “point of use” item since the circulation of air is largely limited to the room in which the head is located in. You can’t expect a single head or two to heat an entire home without having cold spots or pocketed heat. In our case, we have one head in each bedroom, one in each of the primary living areas, and one in the basement for a balanced and comfortable conditioned space. We went this route because the home does not have any existing ductwork.

Your old heat pump with electric backup is a dinosaur compared to modern ASHP systems and your utility surely thanks you for that as temperatures drop. Depending on the age of your system, it may be relying 100% on those electric resistive heat strips as soon as the outdoor temps reach the low teens or high single digits.

If it is not the direction you are already going, you might want to consider a matched inverter heat pump / air handler combo to replace your system which will re-use your existing ductwork and offer a whole home solution. I do CAD drawings and design heating / cooling systems for my primary occupation and have laid out a lot of Samsung inverter air handler and Bosch Bova 2.0 inverter heat pump systems for use here in the northeast of late. I won’t tout one brand name above another in this category. My relationships just happen to be with the 2 brands mentioned here.

The utility companies are really driving this segment of the market through rebates and conversion incentives. Additionally, the federal government is expected to announced their own incentive programs sometime during the first quarter of 2023 as well if things go as anticipated.

Thanks Tom! Your knowledge is far past what I can comprehend about all this. I went with the Trane/Mitsubishi units. My experiences in Florida led me to find the only Trane service company in our area, but that was a good thing. So far they have been a great family-owned business to work with and from what I have seen go the extra mile. I will have the heads and thermostats in each of our bedrooms and in the main living area. Eliminating the main trunk air lines and air handler will free up desperately needed closet space and take the air handler out of the attic accessible only through a TINY scuttle hole in a closet. Every service currently means taking shelves and clothes out of the way. To this accountant it also makes no sense that my heat blows out from there when the attic is an ice box and A/C when it is an oven.

I did pay more and select the “best” units with the highest efficiency over the “good” option. The die is cast, so soon I will find out. Our house is so 1970s old that we also have the original electric radiant heat in our ceilings. A couple rooms no longer work, but most still do. They are instant bonus builders for the executives at Duke Energy, but at least I have built-in emergency heat.

You are definitely right that my current very old system keeps the meter spinning really fast every winter. I am hoping to get some relief from that$$$$$!.

Merry Christmas

 

[LMichaels]

Jon, do you have a basement? If so, how will you be able to keep it warm enough to use? I too thought about those point of use type units but the fact we use the whole house not just upstairs led me away from it and into the very high efficiency unit we now have. In tracking our gas and electric usage. I estimate the system has paid for itself in increased efficiency over the having installed the basic units. I still don't believe in heat pumps (unless they're somehow ground based), and also electric rates in Illinausea are something like the 2nd or 3rd highest in the country.

 

[Jon Tofte]

No, I don’t have a basement. In spite of the fact that we have a major natural gas line running along the highway my street ends at, we have no natural gas available other than paying an extraordinary amount of money to run a line out to it.

I have discovered the many pitfalls of a split-level house. Ducting and placement of an air handler are very challenging, witness the wacky setup a prior owner retrofitted into our home. To move the air handler from the attic to the upstairs of our house would take up almost half of the already limited closet space in that room.

I also looked at possibly doing an LP gas furnace, but the opportunities for providing required drainage is virtually nil. My HVAC contractor also says that the days of gas furnaces are numbered (I will avoid going into a political discussion that he alluded to), so going with this more exotic mini-split solution seems perhaps to be the best fix for my challenging situation. I guess I will find out soon enough. Still waiting due to universal supplier issues affecting so many fields.

I already use a single Trane/Mitsubishi mini-split in my glassed in porch that has been turned into my working remote office. I have been very happy with the excellent quiet job it does, making this room an extension of our house. I turn the heat down to 63 at night, and in a very short time it brings it back up to 69 in spite of all sliding glass door walls. The A/C aspect works even better.

 

[LMichaels]

Then it seems the mini spits are your ticket. Many years ago parents had a tri-level house (or what some would call a split). Although a true split (or bi-level) is really like a ranch bult on an English basement. Tri-levels though a real challenges. Typically you walk into a "main" level with a kitchen, living room and perhaps a dining room, then you need to go up a level for bedrooms and bath(s), or down a level for a family (rec) room, and or perhaps a utility room (likely housing a furnace or heating system of sorts), and laundry area. On my parent's home though they had it made with a small "sub-basement" but those were optional and not common. And yeah they were a royal PIA to put air handling systems in. Jury is out for me regarding heat pumps but I hear the new ones can work into sub zero temps. Son in law knows a couple friends who've had them installed and are quite pleased. Been thinking about getting a mini split for my garage.

 

[Jon Tofte]

While jury is out on how my whole house setup will actually work, I can confidently say a small one would do great in your garage.

Our house is a tri-level, but not evenly “split.”In our house, you come into a foyer at ground level with what I call a “Florida” slab foundation. On that level are also one bedroom, a bathroom and a small family room that opens to the garage. There are two sets of 1/3 height flights of stairs that lead you up on either side to the living room, dining room and kitchen which have a crawl space underneath. Up another flight of stairs (2/3) are the rest of the bedrooms and 2 bathrooms, obviously all above the lower family room and ground level bedroom. This configuration results in three unconnected “attics” making it impossible to readily setup ductwork. With the air handler currently above the upstairs bedrooms, pressure on those vents is way too high, while down below, where we live, it is too low. Even with our upstairs vents closed in our bedroom and mostly in the other two, we still have heat imbalance.

Add a very old heat pump, and some kind of rework was obviously needed. As it is now, I should already be on the board of Duke Energy. They send colorful energy useage reports that show our house way out of bounds in the wintertime with “average” homes our size, let alone “efficient” ones. I will be happy if we can get to average.

 

[LMichaels]

Given the new tech on these new devices it may just work out fine Jon. One thing I have noticed. Our new furnace has resulted in gas bills now with the inflated energy prices we're all suffering through, are no higher (if not lower) than gas bills we saw with the old setup and cheap gas pricing. So there is something to be said for how well the new tech increases output and efficiency. How else could a 70k BTU furnace heat drafty crappy built house when a huge 125k unit needed to work so hard before. And not only do it but do it without even breaking a sweat. Rarely going over 40% output. So with new chemistry on refrigerants and new DC motors and compressor designs those little splits might be just the ticket.

 

[TomRc]

FWIW - I have an additional split system for my Weber garage. It’s just a 12’x20’ pre-built Amish style shed that I ran power to. It has little to no insulation, but I can still head out there, turn on the system, and have a comfortable working space within 15 minutes on both the hottest and coldest of days.

One thing I didn’t mention with our 100% ductless system for the main house is a self-created problem with the gas portion of our bill. With the all-electric heating system and a hybrid heat pump electric water heater, our sole remaining gas appliance (dryer) doesn’t use enough gas in the course of a billing cycle to meet or overcome the utility company’s minimum delivery charges so, in essence, we’ve been paying for gas that we’re not using as a penalty of sorts on a monthly basis for some time now.

I’ve been dragging my feet on rectifying the situation but finally picked up a very nice high-efficiency, 2-stage, 40K Btu gas furnace with an ECM blower valued at about $1800 as a scratch and dent unit at work for just $200. I’m going to self-install it with just a vertical plenum on top with a pair of supply registers cut into it and a filter rack screwed to the side of the unit into the basement which has an open floor plan. It‘ll probably never need to kick onto the 2nd stage of heat so we’ll run the little furnace for heat down there instead of the existing ductless head while maximizing our efficiencies across both systems to balance our utility bill accordingly.