2nd Chance for a True Weber Classic: A 1998 1st Generation Summit 450


 

Jon Tofte

TVWBB Olympian
Not having to have holes drilled (or trying to drill through stainless myself) and eliminating bolts reduces the per application cost of this project which is certainly a plus. Of course, this assumes I can even find a sheet metal shop that will take this on at something I can swallow.
 

THyde

TVWBB Guru
Jon, even if the RTV doesn't hold the stainless panels on, you can always drill holes to mount them later. It's hard to un-drill a hole. But I think the RTV would hold, kind of like if you use a lot of small nails you end up with a firm connection. I'm just thinking here, if you have better ideas of course it's your grill, but again I'd mostly be concerned with making it waterproof, and I'd definitely get some rust converter on the existing porcelain part otherwise the rust will continue inside the sandwich.
 

Bruce

TVWBB 1-Star Olympian
That sounds even better than the regular Red RTV since it is labeled as "FOOD SAFE". I had thought that the regular stuff might not be a good fit for inside the cook box as it might let off harmful fumes.
 

Bruce

TVWBB 1-Star Olympian
Another thing about this idea is why does it have to be a sandwich. Why can't we just use one thicker slice of bread on one side of the original porcelain?
 

Bruce

TVWBB 1-Star Olympian
LOL: Yah, just put a thicker, maybe 14 gauge cover on the inside of the panel and glue it down with the RTV.
 

Jon Tofte

TVWBB Olympian
Another thing about this idea is why does it have to be a sandwich. Why can't we just use one thicker slice of bread on one side of the original porcelain?
Yeah, that idea has merit. It is obviously the inside where the problem is. I guess I had thought in terms of trying to totally confine the rust damaged area so that even if it deteriorates inside, it is totally "encapsulated."

I would be interested in other opinions. I am just an accountant trying to apply common sense and otherwise limited skills/experience to this problem. I just know I want this grill to live again for years to come so that I can grill on a REAL Summit. A @LMichaels ribeye steak dinner sounds really good, too! :coolkettle:
 

THyde

TVWBB Guru
If it's an open faced sandwich, then yes I would put the stainless on the inside. Since the rust is not totally, completely all the way through, again I'd still POR and hi temp paint it, and if you can RTV seal it up then the stainless will take the brunt of the heat from the inside, and the outside will look original, so your guests will be none the wiser. Now I'm wondering whether you'd want to space the stainless a bit, maybe put a few pieces of metal between the stainless and the porcelain coated parts to leave some air between them in order to conduct heat less efficiently.
 

Bruce

TVWBB 1-Star Olympian
I suppose a tiny spacing might help with reducing heat transfer. Maybe a few tiny snippings from the stainless that you use for the panel in between the panel and the porcelain.
 

LMichaels

TVWBB 1-Star Olympian
I was thinking a sandwich with 2 thinner pieces might offer better dissipation of heat. But then hey, who knows? But also thinner metal say 16 or even 18ga would be cheaper and easier to work with.
 

DanHoo

TVWBB Honor Circle
We use ultra copper RTV on rutland gaskets for the BGE. It is rated to 600F continuous. I haven't checked if it is food safe or not.


edit from here:

PRODUCT DESCRIPTION S.I.N.: 834-300
Permatex Ultra Copper is a single component, room
temperature vulcanizing gasketing compound designed to
provide reliable “formed-in-place” gaskets for mechanical
assemblies. This material cures on exposure to moisture in the
air to form a tough, flexible, silicone rubber gasket. The
product resists aging, weathering and thermal cycling without
hardening, shrinking or cracking. Permatex Ultra Copper is
the most advanced high performance, high temperature (up to
700°F intermittent) RTV gasket available.

PRODUCT BENEFITS
• High temperature resistance
• Sensor safe, non-corrosive
• Superior adhesion and flexibility
• Replaces most cut gaskets
• Improved oil resistance
• Can be used as a gasket maker or dressing
• Non-flammable, Non-toxic
• Low odor



 
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THyde

TVWBB Guru
Food safe would be more important to me if it were ever going to be near the food, which it won't.
 

Jon Tofte

TVWBB Olympian
Update: (See also Summit 425 Restoration thread)

I haven’t heard back yet from the union sheet metal shop. In the other thread @Dave in KC suggested I might need to back up the Brinks truck to their shop to be ready to pay🤣. We will see, but I did feel like the guy told me about the Union aspect at the end as a kind of veiled suggestion to look elsewhere.

Today I went to a smaller shop. I liked the guy who would be doing the design work. He didn’t seem to think it was going to be “that bad”. We agreed for him to propose using 14 gauge 304 stainless. I am more hopeful about this possibility.

If the price turns out to be anywhere near realistic, I will be asking here on TVWBB for any others who would want to go in on this project with me. The shop guy said it would definitely bring the per unit price down if I could do a larger quantity.

I am interested in what you all think about getting by with just a stainless panel on the inside? That would obviously cut the price in half compared to my original “sandwich” idea.
 

Bruce

TVWBB 1-Star Olympian
One ply of 14 ga stainless 304 should be plenty for a lot of years of continued use. If I was interested in restoring a Summit, I would be putting my hat in the ring.
 

Bruce

TVWBB 1-Star Olympian
Maybe these guys would fab an actual replacement? I still have the original one, if you'd like it to send to them for a pattern
That would be the ultimate. But, it would be tough to get all the bends in just right to ensure the piece fit properly. I think the labor costs would drive that up too high. But, doesn't hurt to ask.
 

LMichaels

TVWBB 1-Star Olympian
IN any case if you were to go "sandwich" route, I would cut away all the rusted metal 1st. Then treat it with Eastwood or some such product (they have one for exhaust manifolds so would definitely work here. Otherwise if the rusted part was left in the rust would simply continue eating away until there's nothing left for the sandwich to hold on to
 

 

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