Sand or water in water pan.


 
J

Jared

New member
As many may know the question of sand verse water has been a major question and subject of discussion.

I have crawled different forums and websites seeking logical reasons for either.

Until today I stood in agreement with water being used instead sand. I have smoked brisket and beef ribs on different occasions, achieving very good results even for the toughest critics. I used water under the assumption it would help meat remain moisture and control cooking temperature.

I have also cooked chicken in the WSM without a water pan and using lump coal. I have used the WSM with water pan empty also, I have never had a problem setting a temp and holding it during a cook on a WSM. So my thoughts on the water pan for temp control have changed, for my WSM it's pretty much set temp and go using water in pan, empty pan, and no pan at all.

Today I tried sand in the water pan and the food results were the were the same if not better after smoking beef ribs today. The ribs cooked with water and sand seem very close in finial results.

I would have to say at this point I would use sand again because I don't find myself with such a mess at the end of the cook, the wife was very happy to not find a water pan sitting in the kitchen after dinner. I feel like I used less fuel than previous cooks before using water pan.

Hope my experience helps.
 
Jared,use whatever works for you. I was a water guy for the first few years. I bought a clay saucer and haven't looked back!
 
I agree: use what works for you. I've used water, an empty pan, and a saucer. Yet to use sand but never had a problem.
 
I use no water, no sand, and no clay saucer. I just foil an empty pan and have NO problem holding temperatures. It's a heck of a lot easier on cleanup without a pan of water full of grease, I can tell you that! I see NO difference in product, either.

Keep on smokin',
Dale53:wsm:
 
Robert McGee said:
I use no water, no sand, and no clay saucer. I just foil an empty pan and have NO problem holding temperatures. It's a heck of a lot easier on cleanup without a pan of water full of grease, I can tell you that! I see NO difference in product, either.

Keep on smokin',
Dale53:wsm:
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Bingo!
And usually for a brisket, I don't even have a pan in there.
 
WOW! Very interesting. I don't get to cook much on my WSM as I would like, heck I don't get to cook on any of my Weber products as I would like. But this is very helpful. I've tried a foiled pan with no water, and I've used water in the pan. I admit, seeing that nasty grease in the water is a real bummer, but the reward is worth it. I aske Bob one day about this in a PM and he thought that I may not have enough gunk built up to run without water yet, I think he's right, I only have about a dozen or so cook in the meat candy machine. But, I think I'm going to give the clay saucer a try. Thanks for starting this thread!
 
I've moved away from water as well. Currently cooking with nothing in the pan at all and I've noticed my bark is MUCH better.
 
I think a heat sink in the WSM is beneficial, not for controlling temps as much as a moderator of spikes, especially in the first hour or two when your wood often ignites. It also moderates during the whole cook I believe to some degree.
That said the heat sink can be anything with some mass, I use a sand and pea gravel mix and it has worked like a charm.
Just my 2cents
 
I should mention that I sit the foiled OEM small pan, that came with my older 18.5, inside a larger Brinkmann pan.
This creates a dead air space similar to the Piedmont mod.

And occasionally I'll add about a quart of water at the start of a cook.
The water is usually gone by the end, so no nasty grease-water.
 
I run an empty pan, and am kicking around the idea of no pan at all.

A heat sink (water, sand, gravel, bricks, whatever) does two things:

1. When the heat sink is colder than the temp in the smoker, it absorbs heat. Meaning some of the fuel you're burning is going toward putting heat into the heat sink instead of into your meat when you start your cook.

2. When the heat sink is hotter than the temp in the smoker, it radiates heat. Meaning when you open the lid and close it back up, it helps heat the air in the smoker back up.

Sounds good, right? Here's the reason I don't use one though--the WSM is incredibly efficient at heating itself up. At the beginning of your cook, it will come up to temp faster without the heat sink. When you open the lid and close it back up, not only does the air in the smoker heat back up quickly, but opening the lid let the fire take a big old gulp of air, so it will actually burn *hotter* and heat the smoker back up even faster.
 
Thanks for all the GREAT input.

Here are some of the issues and questions I face regarding the heat sink.

My first few cooks I would distribute the smoking wood throughout the coals during the cook, with intentions to only open the smoker to check/add water after several hours for a brisket cook. This method was good but I did notice inconsistency with the burning of the smoking wood. It seems that the first few hours are most important for smoking process. So I'm left trying to mix wood in with charcoal as not to over smoke but provide consistent smoke for the first several hours, a difficult task.

I find it much easier to add wood as needed during the cook providing a consistent smoke. However because I use the access door every couple hours having the heat sink maybe beneficial in maintaining a steady temp.
 
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Dave Alvarado said:
I run an empty pan, and am kicking around the idea of no pan at all.
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So w/out any pan or diffuser in place you would be cooking direct vs. indirect. I've never done this but some do, I imagine things would cook much faster and you will have that grease dripping on coals taste.. some like it some don't.
 
Jared said:
I find it much easier to add wood as needed during the cook providing a consistent smoke. However because I use the access door every couple hours having the heat sink maybe beneficial in maintaining a steady temp.
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I haven't found that "consistent smoke" matters in any way. I've put wood around the edges of the coal ring on top, I've mixed it in, and I've put some on top and some buried, both around the edges. In all cases, the smoke flavor came out the same. The only thing that seemed to matter is if foiling is part of the cooking process--in that case, wood chunks under all the coals don't necessarily lend their smoke flavor to the meat, since they may not have lit by the time you foil.

Remember, smoke "flavor" actually comes from particles that sit on the surface of the meat. They don't absorb, and leaving them on there longer doesn't matter. Only how many of them get stuck. That's why a more humid environment can give you more smoke flavor with less wood (more particles stick per chunk of wood).

If you think of smoke like a seasoning it might help. If you're applying pepper to a piece of meat, it doesn't really matter if you shake it all on at once or if you sprinkle on a little pinch, then another little pinch, then another little pinch. In the end all that matters is whether you put on the right amount of pepper.

Try just putting chunks of wood around the edges of your charcoal ring and see how that works out for you. If you want more smoke flavor, use an extra chunk or two or switch to a bolder wood like hickory. I bet you'll find that you can get the taste you want without having to open the smoker all the time and screwing up your temps.

John Segura said:
So w/out any pan or diffuser in place you would be cooking direct vs. indirect. I've never done this but some do, I imagine things would cook much faster and you will have that grease dripping on coals taste.. some like it some don't.
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I can't really speak to this since I'm still experimenting with it. I have found that the grease drippings don't really affect temps and unless you seriously load down the smoker the risk of putting out your fire with grease is very minimal. Also whatever is facing the fire will cook more quickly and has a chance to burn, so fat side down seems to be the way to go. I haven't decided yet whether having to get into the smoker to rotate meats is worth the better flavor and zero clean-up.
 
Dave Alvarado said:
I haven't found that "consistent smoke" matters in any way. I've put wood around the edges of the coal ring on top, I've mixed it in, and I've put some on top and some buried, both around the edges. In all cases, the smoke flavor came out the same. The only thing that seemed to matter is if foiling is part of the cooking process--in that case, wood chunks under all the coals don't necessarily lend their smoke flavor to the meat, since they may not have lit by the time you foil.

Remember, smoke "flavor" actually comes from particles that sit on the surface of the meat. They don't absorb, and leaving them on there longer doesn't matter. Only how many of them get stuck. That's why a more humid environment can give you more smoke flavor with less wood (more particles stick per chunk of wood).

If you think of smoke like a seasoning it might help. If you're applying pepper to a piece of meat, it doesn't really matter if you shake it all on at once or if you sprinkle on a little pinch, then another little pinch, then another little pinch. In the end all that matters is whether you put on the right amount of pepper.

Try just putting chunks of wood around the edges of your charcoal ring and see how that works out for you. If you want more smoke flavor, use an extra chunk or two or switch to a bolder wood like hickory. I bet you'll find that you can get the taste you want without having to open the smoker all the time and screwing up your temps.
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Thanks for the input. However I feel different about your ideas on smoke flavor.
I have, without question, tasted smokey flavor well below the surface of smoked meats. For example, when I smoke turkey I remove the skin when finished and slice the turkey. On all peices of meat including breast meat from the thickest part of the beast has at least a very small amount of smoke flavor.
I have also noticed a difference when adding smoke later in a cook. I haven't tried with larger cuts of meat on longer cooks, but I have with things on the grill. For example chicken breast, I sear the breast then cook them indirect adding smoke later, the taste of smoke appears to be more on the surface of the meat oppose to with it.
If I sear the meat while wood in smoking I get a better smoke flavor within the meat itself.

I'll give it a try with wood setup as you mentioned in my WSM.

But I'm sure the "first few" hours of a cook are critical for a smoke ring and embedded smoke flavor. In my humble opinion and experience.
 
Jared said:
Thanks for the input. However I feel different about your ideas on smoke flavor.
I have, without question, tasted smokey flavor well below the surface of smoked meats. For example, when I smoke turkey I remove the skin when finished and slice the turkey. On all peices of meat including breast meat from the thickest part of the beast has at least a very small amount of smoke flavor.
I have also noticed a difference when adding smoke later in a cook. I haven't tried with larger cuts of meat on longer cooks, but I have with things on the grill. For example chicken breast, I sear the breast then cook them indirect adding smoke later, the taste of smoke appears to be more on the surface of the meat oppose to with it.
If I sear the meat while wood in smoking I get a better smoke flavor within the meat itself.

I'll give it a try with wood setup as you mentioned in my WSM.

But I'm sure the "first few" hours of a cook are critical for a smoke ring and embedded smoke flavor. In my humble opinion and experience.
Click to expand...

Yep, and Your experience speaks volumes.
Some proteins like poultry or meat-loaf take on smoke flavor much more than a big ole hunk of pork or beef.
Sometimes you get that perfect balance of smoke flavor, and sometimes not. Imo It has a lot to do with just experimenting and learning how your WSM acts in your backyard.
Seems to me Jarred you already have that part down pat!:wsm:

Tim
 
I'm the only one here that uses a steel disk in the pan. I've posted about it several times before, it heats up with the smoker, it doesn't absorb heat so there isn't anything to release which can cause roller coaster temps, it weighs less than water or sand and just as easy to clean as an empty pan. It does radiate even heat and blocks the direct heat which can burn or scorch your food. Temps are unbelievably easy to control and it helps conserve fuel. As stated earlier, try what you like and use what works best for you.
 
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