Interestingly terrible steak on the kettle


 
J

Jonas-Switzerland

TVWBB Fan
Did my second steak on the kettle. It was terrible for my standards. I write my thoughts down to put them in order. Maybe you can chime in with your superior wisdom.

My perfect steak has an edge-to-edge medium rare to medium doneness. I used to cook them on the gasser, pre heated the cast iron grates, full sear, and then an indirect finish at 120c/275f.

My first steak on the kettle was pretty good. I used a single weber basket full of lump charcoal. Similar to this video, I seared both steaks for 30secs on the flame and 30secs off, for several round

Always with the lid off. Apart from the indirect finish until it had the right doneness.

Today, I was in a rush (always a bad idea). I did want to improve the sear, so I used two baskets, but I misjudged my chimney starter. I had 1 full, and one half-full basket. I gave them 30secs each side with the lid off, but blew some extra air into the coals to hopefully improve the sear. Then I closed the lid to speed up the cook. Now another 30secs each side, for two rounds. Again, I let the other piece cook indirectly while one was directly over the coals. Afterwards I checked the steaks for doneness by pressing on them, and cursed: It was as hard as "well-done" overcooked steak. It was on the grill for 6-9mins.

Then I cut it up and...
IMG_20241208_171512.jpg
It was not well-done internally. You see here a cut from the side of the steak, cut-up for my kid. It had a big "cooked" grey border, and the center was medium. But it was as tough overcooked steak.

That's why this cook stays in my head. Any time I did a similarly tough steak, I had a more cooked steak. This here was one of the toughest medium steaks I had. Something I did made them extra tough, and I wonder what it was.

Certainly the indirect cook was on the hot side. The dome thermometer was around180C-200C. But it was closer to the coals than the resting steak. Then again, I also lifted the lid regularly.

The closed lid while searing itself puzzles me. Because I also grilled steaks with the lid down on the gasser, and never eith that of a bad result. I wonder if the lid of a charcoal vs gas grill results in a meaningfully different cooking chamber.

The technique of the video definitely helps with having more edge-to-edge color. The first steaks saw several more rounds of sear+rest, and had a much more red. I wonder if a cool-off period between sears also helps with tenderness.
 
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For steaks on the kettle, I basically follow the reverse sear method described here: https://snsgrills.com/pages/steak?srsltid=AfmBOop8vBxe9ExTnI1KV5W1vkWAa_UjbopcULTQ0LY5l_WBgbDcmvOO

You don't need to own their products to accomplish it; you can just shove both Weber charcoal baskets to one side.

I start the steaks off on the indirect side, and when the internal temperature of the steaks reaches about 100 F (37.8 C) I pull them off, and follow the instructions in the link: pat dry, coat with olive oil, and cover in black pepper. Then I sear for 1-2 minutes each side directly over the hot coals, having added some new ones if needed per the instructions in the link above.

If the indirect portion of your cook runs hotter than intended, you can try taking the steak off a little earlier than you think you need to as there will likely be more "carry-over" cooking than you expect; someone who is more knowledgeable about thermodynamics than me can explain the science much better than I can.
 
I'm also a member of the reverse sear club. Do you have an instant read thermometer? I've given up cooking by feel and now only cook to temp.

Depending on the cut of beef and how thick of a cut it changes the internal temp target for the initial stage. If it is a thicker cut that is fairly lean I'll bring the internal temp to 121F (49C) before reverse searing. A thinner cut or very lean I'll target 110F (43C) and if its a thick fatty rib steak I'll take it up to 125F to 130F.

@Jonas-Switzerland what cut of beef and how thick was it? Some cuts also are more tender when sliced across the grain.
 
DanHoo said:
Depending on the cut of beef and how thick of a cut it changes the internal temp target for the initial stage. If it is a thicker cut that is fairly lean I'll bring the internal temp to 121F (49C) before reverse searing. A thinner cut or very lean I'll target 110F (43C) and if its a thick fatty rib steak I'll take it up to 125F to 130F.
Click to expand...

I tend to pull my steak off a little early because I'm good at overshooting and/or searing for too long.

I need to get more disciplined with my temperature control during the indirect step so I'm not having excessive carry-over cooking.
 
I always light the charcoal and go indirect first.
A nice big load of charcoal so it sits up high near the grate.
Watch them a bit and keep the temps fairly low.......
Once I see anywhere from 90 to 105 if I am lucky enough to catch it by then I take the lid off for 5 to 10 minutes so it is as hot as can be.
I sear at that point, basically it looks like flames are devouring the steak but it all is good.
Your steak at that point should be as you described as how you wanted it to be.
I like a steak that can be described as chicago rare.......
Works for me anyways.
Pic is a good idea.


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Michael Chen said:
I tend to pull my steak off a little early because I'm good at overshooting and/or searing for too long.

I need to get more disciplined with my temperature control during the indirect step so I'm not having excessive carry-over cooking.
Click to expand...

A remote thermometer with an alarm handles this job for me. I set the target alarm temp a couple of degrees below my smoke-stage target temp and when it buzzes I know its time to prep for the sear stage. I double check with an instant read before I end the smoke stage.

99% of of beef steaks and roasts I'll take the time to use a temp probe in and set an alarm.
 
About a year ago i was cruising the internet reading up on different cooking ideas on U Tube. well i saw this one guy talk about cooking Tri- Tip two ways one is what you were doing and i had been doing which was okay. sometimes better then other times.
So he shows how to make it cooked perfect and juicy.
1) after a complete thaw trim off and silver skin and weird meat pieces along the edges.
2) using a fork, or tenderizer go over the meat both sides so it is well cover with holes to let the seasoning in, I do not have one of these but i do have stainless steel chop sticks that work perfect for me and reduce my frustration level too.
3)rub the meat down with your type of oil,Olive, Avocado, I use Sesame as my wife is Korean
4) then use good sea salt or Coarser salt put on a nice layer not to heavy put on a cooking pan and rack into the frig for 3-4 hours or better overnight uncovered.
5) in morning while you are getting everything ready charcoal etc. add your pepper and garlic powder( or Granulated) and let it warm up to close to room temp.
I have a slow and sear but i have done this with baskets also even out the charcoal between baskets and small pieces of wood like oak or hickory.
place meat indirect thick side towards heat. i use a wired thermometer to monitor internal temps. when meat gets to about 85-90 rotate 180 degrees And at 105- 110 slide the meat over the direct coals on a Tri-Tip you can go about 90 seconds a side and 30-45 seconds on edges till internal temp hits about 132-138ish pull rest and slice medium rare, so the wife will eat it.
I do the same with seats i adjust the sear time down to ever thickness i am cooking today.the over night rest in the fridge really makes the meat tender as the salt helps break down the heavy fibers.
I also did this with my last 2 Briskets and the were a big hit by all.
sorry for being wordy
 
DanHoo said:
A remote thermometer with an alarm handles this job for me. I set the target alarm temp a couple of degrees below my smoke-stage target temp and when it buzzes I know its time to prep for the sear stage. I double check with an instant read before I end the smoke stage.

99% of of beef steaks and roasts I'll take the time to use a temp probe in and set an alarm.
Click to expand...

I always either have my Smoke or Signals plugged into the beef, but I sometimes get lazy (key word here) and skip the air temperature probe. Also, sometimes it just feels like too tight of a fit on the 18-inch kettle when I've got a bunch of thick ribeyes on.

I've inadvertently gotten the temperature inside SUPER hot even during the indirect stage (usually too many lit coals plus too much air), and when I do that, I get way more carry-over cooking than expected when I pull the steaks off to prepare for the sear.

Steak will still be tender and delicious, but it will be way closer to well-done than I expected, so I like to err on the side of caution. :LOL:
 
Michael Chen said:
I always either have my Smoke or Signals plugged into the beef, but I sometimes get lazy (key word here) and skip the air temperature probe. Also, sometimes it just feels like too tight of a fit on the 18-inch kettle when I've got a bunch of thick ribeyes on.

I've inadvertently gotten the temperature inside SUPER hot even during the indirect stage (usually too many lit coals plus too much air), and when I do that, I get way more carry-over cooking than expected when I pull the steaks off to prepare for the sear.

Steak will still be tender and delicious, but it will be way closer to well-done than I expected, so I like to err on the side of caution. :LOL:
Click to expand...

I use the alarm also but i also use my quick read thermo pen to verify. yes i have had a few steaks go farther than i wanted way to quickly but they were still good.
 
Reverse sear is the better way to handle it. Just my .02 Although I've not been a fan of those super hot sear tactics. Preferring a reasonable overall Maillard and an edge to edge med rare to rare (depending on the cut I am cooking strips and filet rare and ribeye to more of a mid-rare to medium).
In any case now having the pellet grills I am finding I am getting the best steaks ever.
 
Jonas -- a few thoughts for you.

It was not well-done internally. You see here a cut from the side of the steak, cut-up for my kid. It had a big "cooked" grey border, and the center was medium. But it was as tough overcooked steak.

I'd describe your cook as an overdone Pittsburgh blue or rare steak. Charred outside and near raw on the inside, but you cooked it too long. Some people like that; me not so much. Comes from using very high heat energy. FYI "heat energy" is not exactly the same thing as "high temperature."

Certainly the indirect cook was on the hot side. The dome thermometer was around180C-200C. But it was closer to the coals than the resting steak. Then again, I also lifted the lid regularly.

The closed lid while searing itself puzzles me. Because I also grilled steaks with the lid down on the gasser, and never eith that of a bad result. I wonder if the lid of a charcoal vs gas grill results in a meaningfully different cooking chamber.

Charcoal uses a different type of heat energy than a gas grill. Charcoal cooks primarily by infrared radiation. Which is a powerful browner/searer. But very easy to overdo it with IR radiation. Cooking direct over charcoal with the lid down makes the overdo risk even worse.

Gas grill cooks mostly by convection (i.e. hot air). Convection is very meh for browning/searing. And since the mechanism is hot air, cooking with the lid open just means cooking slow/cool. You'd never cook in your kitchen oven (i.e. a convection hot air device) with the door open.

Lid open cooking is really more of a thing when cooking with radiation (charcoal or IR burner) or conduction (griddle, cast iron pan) which have more browning/Maillard oomph.

When cooking over charcoal, you should sear direct and you can do that with the lid off -- radiation does not care about the lid. What matters for radiation is (i) how close the food is to the coals and (ii) how many coals are going. With charcoal, you can sear up front or sear in the rear. Both work.

The rest of the charcoal cook should be indirect (which switches you from jacked up radiation to more chill convection). Lid on makes sense for convection. The Amazing Ribs link below is the best explanation I've ever seen on the differences between convection vs. radiation vs. conduction. Totally bumped up my grilling game.

A great method (for radiation or conduction steak cooking) is the "JKF" or just keep flipping method. See link below. The constant flipping reduces the gray section because the top side cools off when it gets flipped from the bottom side. Better than the traditional "only flip once" method imo. And you get a good crust too that builds up gradually from when the steak is on the bottom side. I find the JKF much easier to pull off consistently than the reverse sear.


amazingribs.com

The Thermodynamics of Cooking and How Different Cooking Methods Work

Learn about thermodynamics: the basis of all cooking! Find out how heat transference works by conduction, convection, radiation, induction, and infrared heat in your grill, bbq, and smoker.
amazingribs.com

www.seriouseats.com

Flip Your Steaks Multiple Times for Better Results | The Food Lab

Let's start this post with the most basic of statements: <strong>Flipping your steak often during grilling or pan-searing will result in the best, most evenly cooked meat.</strong> Okay, it's probably not a big spoiler to anyone around here anymore. But it's the <em>why</em> that really makes...
www.seriouseats.com www.seriouseats.com
 
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Personally I'm not an exponant of the reverse sear method. YMMV.

Ripping hot basket, vortex etc. A chilled steak straight from the fridge. Place over the coals and flip every minute to desired char on both sides.
Move to indirect, stick a probe in and bring it up to 125IT. Rest. Eat.

Edit: When searing I always sear with the lid off. Move to indirect, lid on until desired IT. Please don't press your steaks with your finger to check for doneness. Use a meat thermometer.
 
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