High temp brisket question


 
I get that. But you introduced a 225 start into the equation after staing you wanted to try a high heat method--that prompted the question.

You can high heat the whole thing; you can low/slow the ribs then bump up the temps for the brisket, cooking them after the ribs; you can reverse that, lowering the temps between cooks; you can either or both low/slow then finish high; you can low/slow the whole deal. No need to bother with an oven in any scenario.

So as not to complicate things, were it me, I'd just high heat the whole thing, starting the ribs with the brisket if they're spares and foiiling at the same time (realizing the ribs might finish sooner depending on the thickness of the brisket); or if I had back ribs, starting them probably at the same time, but knowing I'll likely foil the ribs a bit sooner and they'll be done sooner as well. When the brisket is taking its 20-min rest I could return the ribs to the cooker, unfoiled, to heat.
 
Nope. Though I like doing spares ~285 (backs 50? higher) I have had several occasions where time was tight or I already had the cooker going higher and so I just cooked them like that.

Here is an example of a high heat spare cook. For this cook I started as I usually do, a MM using ~25 lit and a maybe 8-12 small pieces of wood. (I never use 'fist-sized' wood. 4-5 of my pieces = 1 fist-sized.) No water; foiled pan. I keep my door upside down (knob on bottom) as a rule. When the temps reach the upper 200s I determine if I'll need to prop the door open a little to continue the rise (I did in this case) and then do so. I increased temps after foiling.

When I've done spares at the end of a high heat cook and the cooker is already hot, the cook is shorter, even without foiling.

The trick, if one can call it that, is simply testing for done, which you should do anyway regardless of cooktemp, rather than relying on time. I probe between the bones and look for the probe to enter effortlessly. (If I foil I finish in foil--I do not foil in the middle of the cook--so I probe through the foil when I think the ribs should be done. I'll open the foil and probe to confirm or, if not ready, will cook longer and probe again. Cooking 'longer' when cooking at high heat, especially once foiled, means maybe 7-10 min for spares, 15-20 for brisket. If neither are tender when you first check and you're checking around the time you think they should be, don't cook longer than those times before checking again.)
 
I think I'll try a high heat brisket and low/slow ribs. I'm having company over this weekend and I don't want to experiment with both dishes. I've done low/slow ribs with great success, so I'll play this one safe.

Is it difficult to bring down a raging high heat WSM to low/slow WSM? Just close the bottom vents and wait for it to drop?

Thanks!
 
Yes, but adding a heat sink will help. When you foil your pan for the high heat cook press the foil into the pan almost to--but not directly against--the pan sides. (An airspace will keep dripping brisket fat from burning.) Minion the start for the brisket. When the brisket is removed, close lower vents and carefully add some cold water to the pan.

That said, it is easier, imo, to do the ribs first if you want to low/slow. Minion the start without using many lit and use nothing in the pan (foil the pan as noted above). Load in your ribs as soon as you add the lit and assemble the cooker. Start closing lower vents a little sooner than usual (since you have no heat sink in the pan) and cook your ribs as desired. When just tender remove the ribs and allow to cool uncovered. Stick in the fridge loosely covered to hold.

Add a chimney of lit, if needed, and some unlit, when you remove the ribs and open all lower vents. Add new smokewood and your brisket. Watch temps, propping open the door if necessary to get the temps to ~325-335. Foil the brisket when the internal hits the 160s or just foil after a couple hours or so. Let the temp but up to 350-360 if you wish and cook till probe or fork tender (not to a specific temp), probably 3:45-4:00 from the start. (If thin check earlier. If not tender when first checked, cook 15 or so more and gauge from there.)

Remove the ribs from the fridge when the brisket should be nearing done. When it is, remove it and rest 20 min or so, using that time to reheat the ribs in the still-hot cooker.

Just a thought.
 
Originally posted by chris comer:
Will I be able to hit these high temps with kingsford or do you need lump to reach high heat brisket temps?
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Chris, you can use K no problem. Might have to prop the door open, or what I do is leave my lid hanging off the edge of the mid section lip by about a 1/4" or so. IMO this works better than the door thing (most of the heat rolls out the door). You get a pretty accurate lid temp this way. When my lid thermo hits 325º I move the lid back on right. WSM stays there througout the cook. My WSM has always run cold, so I relly don't get any over drift on temp when I put the lid on right. Might go to 340º but drops back down rather quick. HTH
 
Originally posted by K Kruger:
Here is an example of a high heat spare cook. For this cook I started as I usually do, a MM using ~25 lit and a maybe 8-12 small pieces of wood. (I never use 'fist-sized' wood. 4-5 of my pieces = 1 fist-sized.) No water; foiled pan. I keep my door upside down (knob on bottom) as a rule. When the temps reach the upper 200s I determine if I'll need to prop the door open a little to continue the rise (I did in this case) and then do so. I increased temps after foiling.
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Been away a couple weeks since I learned how to do these high-heat cooks. This one above sounds fun.

I have anoter gathering in a few weeks. Thinking about a few racks of spares (maybe backs would be better) on the top grate with a brisket on the bottom.

Ever done a high-heat cook with a brisket on the bottom grate? Anything different in that case?
 
Great info, and timely! While I don't (yet!) have a WSM, currently struggling with a modded ECB, I did a flat on Saturday, and while it was pretty good was just too dry. While I did have some temp spikes, mine was pretty much low 'n slow. Someone else on a different board also recommended the high heat method, only the temp recommended was 260 for brisket. Interesting....

So, next time I'll definitely try the high heat!
 
Steven--I am rather idiosyncratic--I almost never do mixed meat cooks. There is no reason why you can't. This is hard to describe but one, I make different rubs for different meats and two, I use the way the meat smells as the cook progresses to tell me how things are going. With different rubs on different meats the nose gets confused!

Alan-- To me, 260 is low/slow, 275-290 is 'higher' heat, and 300+ is 'high heat'. Semantics. Most of my high heat stuff is 325-335, then 350-370 once foiled (babybacks and brisket); my higher heat stuff is 275-290 (spares and butts), although if an overnight is more convenient I'll gladly do butts low/slow.

Anyway, no problem mixing meats. You can do the brisket on the bottom--just remember fatcap down. After foiling, you can stack each foiled meat atop each other all on the top grate, if there's room, or split them between the two grates.
 
Alan D, since wer'e in the same part thought I'd pass on some info on meat sources if you don't already know.

If I'm doing a competition brisket, I like PWs, they carry prime (Brandt Meats) which I cook at about 250. They carry nice size flats with a decent fat cap at about 6 lbs. I recently beat out many other teams with hugh rigs using the WSM and a PW brisket.

Non compettion I rarely cook brisket, prefer shoulder meat instead. But if it's a select brisket, I cook at higher temps as previously described by others.

Cash in Carry on San Carlos Ave has nice shoulder rolls (about 20-25 lbs.). Cut in two pieces one for each grate and cook like a brisket.

Other than that I pretty much cook as described, foil at about 160 or so, cook until tender, etc.

If I have time I use a wet rub the night before, then a dry rub before going on the cooker.

I just foil the water pan, no water, no clay pot, or guru devises. Use the vents to control temps.

Also I don't let the WSM get up to temps before adding meat. I minion the coals, immediately assemble it, and add the meat. Many times I add the meat right from the package to the WSM and rub while on the WSM. Eliminates the step of using a tray to add rub.

Good luck

John
 
I just want to add in here that I did a high temp brisket this past weekend. It turned out very good. I plan to use this method for now on. It was nice, starting a brisket right before breakfast and having it for lunch.

However, I did have quite a time trying to keep the WSM in the 350 range. I was using lump and I kept having to open and close the draft door to keep the temp from getting too high/low. Not sure if the water in my water pan dept bringing the temps down.

Any tips on keeping that temp would be helpful, since I plan to try again this weekend.
 
There is no need to use water in the pan at all so don't. Doing so will make it harder for you to maintain higher temps. I often (but not always) need to prop open my door a little bit and leave it that way. (Door flipped so knob on bottom; propped 1/4-1 inch, depending.)
 
I did a high heat brisket this weekend and it was fantastic! Probably the best one I have ever had. Very moist and succulent. My most humble thanks to Kevin, Craig, Bryan and everyone else who advocates for high heat brisket cooks.

As for keeping the temp up, I had previously done the Door Prop Mod on my WSM so I could set it open to kick it up when needed. I use the clay pot as well but I am not sure that makes much difference versus empty bowl. Wouldn't use water though.

Complement that brisket with the No. 5 Sauce with mustard powder and honey added along with brisket drippings and that is a great combo (though like me, you might not need sauce but the wife loves that No. 5.)

All the best,
Tom
 
Originally posted by Bryan S:
I don't understand how you can comment on how a lot of us have been cooking briskets for years at High Heat when you don't even own a WSM.
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I'd bet every penny I have that my high heat brisket will be so much more moist than your low and slow brisket.
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After getting my WSM, and having done a low-slow brisket on it, I'm still happy doing it low-slow, and in fact I like the bark.

I think this is purely a case of personal preference. I'm not convinced I need to change too much, I am pretty happy with the couple low-slow briskets I've done.
 
Having done briskets low and slow before, and now having done high heat for quite a while, I think the consistency of a finished product one gets from a high heat cook is leap years greater than low and slow.

Hey, but whatever works is great.

JMO.
 
Originally posted by craig castille:
Hey, but whatever works is great.
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It works for me and if high heat works for others, I say more power to them. Maybe at some point I'll try high heat and like it, I don't know...but it reminds me of the meat in chinese delis, with the shiny outside, no bark. Not that the style is bad which high heat produces, the inside of the meat looks great!
 
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