Bob H.
TVWBB Hall of Fame
Joe, your bagels look TOO GOOD to eat!
Bagels - First time
- Thread starter Joe Anshien
- Start date
Brett-EDH
TVWBB Hall of Fame
lox freezes well. just double wrap in plastic wrap and add the slightest amount if oil so the lox doesn't freezer burn.
any pics of your cured salmon slab? you're brave using wild salmon. i've only used farm raised and have been very happy with the results.
great work and killer bagels! as for savings, there is some making your own, using farm raised salmon. shrinkage is low after the cure but the flavor difference between commercial and homemade is miles apart, IMO.
Joe Anshien
TVWBB Platinum Member
Sorry I should have taken pics of the filet but totally spaced. I promise next time, and pretty sure there will be a next time;-) We try eating only wild caught sea food (mostly USA) after seeing a few documentaries on sea food farming practices in addition to the ecological damages a lot of farms do. Also not crazy about the idea of feeding the fish food with coloring / dyes in it.
Rich G
TVWBB Honor Circle
Joe, I've experienced similar "deflation" when I make boiled bagels. And while I recognize that every New Yorker will hate me for saying this.....I think I've figured out that I don't like boiled bagels as much. (Ducks for cover!) 
I don't have a solution for you, but I am going to try out a recipe for "Jerusalem" bagels, which are a non-boiled street food item that seems to be more typically elongated, rather than round like a "traditional" bagel. Since they aren't boiled, they shouldn't suffer from deflation after the proof. We'll see.
BTW, your bagels look fantastic. Crust and crumb look as they should for a more traditional, NY style bagel.
I don't have a solution for you, but I am going to try out a recipe for "Jerusalem" bagels, which are a non-boiled street food item that seems to be more typically elongated, rather than round like a "traditional" bagel. Since they aren't boiled, they shouldn't suffer from deflation after the proof. We'll see.
BTW, your bagels look fantastic. Crust and crumb look as they should for a more traditional, NY style bagel.
Brett-EDH
TVWBB Hall of Fame
not true. you're still good by me. Noah's does a steamed bagel. maybe look into that method?every New Yorker will hate me for saying this.....I think I've figured out that I don't like boiled bagels as much. (Ducks for cover!)
My observation, having made a few bagels here & there, is that condition comes from an over hydrated dough as well as possibly boiling too long.
Me, personally, I do like a good boiled bagel.
Joe Anshien
TVWBB Platinum Member
I just did some research and I think I will try boiling a little less next time. I have been doing 1 1/2 minutes per side. Next time I will try 4 @ 45 seconds and 4 at 1 minute. I think that will keep more yeast alive for them to keep puffed up a little more. I will post results. I may even try to bake them on the grill to keep the heat out of the house.
To me (but maybe not for others), the very definition of "bagel" includes boiling as an integral part of how they are made. I could accept Noah's steaming as an alternative. If you aren't boiling or steaming your bagels when you make them, then I would not call the resulting product, "bagel". It may be something delicious anyway, but I would not call it a bagel.
The Jerusalem bagels I have seen and eaten are larger round or oval breads, what I could call "family size." They are called "bagels" because of the shape resemblance. Some are round and often they are racetrack shape, but in my mind they are not traditional bagels. I have bought many locally, and also when I lived and worked in several Middle East countries. Delicious bread, but not a "bagel" in the traditional sense.
The bagels and lox pictured here look very yummy indeed.
The Jerusalem bagels I have seen and eaten are larger round or oval breads, what I could call "family size." They are called "bagels" because of the shape resemblance. Some are round and often they are racetrack shape, but in my mind they are not traditional bagels. I have bought many locally, and also when I lived and worked in several Middle East countries. Delicious bread, but not a "bagel" in the traditional sense.
The bagels and lox pictured here look very yummy indeed.
Joe Anshien
TVWBB Platinum Member
I would agree. A bagel should be boiled. I had not heard of a Jerusalem bagel before this thread. Sounds more like bread shaped like a bagel. I also believe that they should be seasoned on BOTH sides. Otherwise I have to cut them into 4 to share them with the wife as we both don't want the plain side;-) Check out this NY Bagel shop video.
Yes. A Jerusalem bagel is bread shaped like a giant bagel with a sesame seed coating. They are not boiled. I have never seen one without sesame seeds. Most are shaped like an oval "racetrack", but I have seen some that were round like a circle. They have a uniform white bread crumb on the inside.
https://www.google.com/search?q=jerusalem+bagel&tbm=isch
In the Middle East, you can see people selling them on the streets. They carry them stacked on a board with a long wood dowel running through them. They are inexpensive and delicious.
https://www.google.com/search?q=jerusalem+bagel&tbm=isch
In the Middle East, you can see people selling them on the streets. They carry them stacked on a board with a long wood dowel running through them. They are inexpensive and delicious.
Ryan Ahearn
New member
I baked bagels, and made the dough for 12+ years. I've never tried a non boiled bagel that could compare to a true water bagel. I am going to try some of the recipes for non water bagels and see if they're close. Feel free to reply to this at all hours because my sleep pattern is still messed up from going in @ 130 am.