New Weber grill....question about sear station and quality


 
LMichaels said:
Sadly even at that $169 price there most likely was still a huge profit............Thanks to Chinese production. The new stuff is over priced period by a HUGE margin. Also with re to say a Member's Mark product there are different products they sell under that moniker. If you research their upper end product, you'll find about the same overall build and better material quality overall than Weber and a lifetime warranty to boot all for under $500! I'm sorry, $500 for lifetime warranty and pretty much equal build? Compared to $1000 (maybe more) and 10 year (maybe) warranty? Do the math. But yeah if I could snare a new Weber II series for under $200 I'd be jumping all over that like white on rice!
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Yah, I was wondering how much of a profit Walmart and Weber makes on these things. $169 is a steal IMO, $699 is just crazy.
 
LMichaels said:
The one I am referring to has a stainless steel fire box. IMO that is fine
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I've never seen one in my home state with a stainless firebox? Not doubting you just haven't seen it. But I do wonder if those hold up for decades like the cast aluminum do.
 
I would think they would. Even lower quality SS will hold up quite well unless it's paper thin but in the case of the unit I saw they claim it's 304SS though I did not test it with a magnet but I did look at the thickness and it was pretty substantial
 
Sam Bee said:
As long as there is a Walmart that has it for $169 near you then that's good. What you have to do is order it online (have it shipped to the store that has it for $169 per brickseek) for full price, pick it up when it comes in and then do a return/rebuy at the CS desk after you've picked it up. Just tell them you want to use a different credit card when they ask for a reason. When they credit you back you'll get the $699 back on the original credit card you used and when they scan it in store for the rebuy it should ring up at the clearance price of $169. That's how a lot of the folks have done it.
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There were no listings at all anywhere near me. I'd love to have one for $169
 
LMichaels said:
I would think they would. Even lower quality SS will hold up quite well unless it's paper thin but in the case of the unit I saw they claim it's 304SS though I did not test it with a magnet but I did look at the thickness and it was pretty substantial
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I'll disagree about lower quality stainless. The burner covers/flavorizors on my old kenmore were stainless. Probably lower grade. They weren't paper thin but I had to replace them every year. From rust through. I think there is a good reason weber and broil king both use cast aluminium for the firebox on most of their grills.
 
Cast aluminum is FAR FAR cheaper than stainless. Also you may have been mistaking galvanized for stainless which is easy to do sometimes
 
LMichaels said:
Cast aluminum is FAR FAR cheaper than stainless. Also you may have been mistaking galvanized for stainless which is easy to do sometimes
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Expensive doesn't elevate correlate to better. I'm guessing this is the better grade members mark you are talking about?

https://m.samsclub.com/ip/6-burner-gas-grill/prod20650624#

If you look in the frequently asked questions on the website regarding the grade of stainless it states low grade 430. There are also reviews stating problems with rust with this model.

No doubt it looks like it's a little better made than your standard char broil type grill. But IMO no way it lasts like a weber or broil king.
 
Greg M said:
Here's my opinion on current weber quality. I think the older models were simpler and somewhat better in quality. And I love my two older webers. BUT I know a number of people who have bought webers within the last few years and are VERY pleased with them. Every single one of those people think their weber is a big step up from their prior char broil, kenmore, or members mark. Does the extra quality justify the price? That's something that's an individual decision.

I agree that one of the main problem points with the newer webers is the enclosed cart. Weber was really wise in my opinion to go back to the open design.

BUT just because a product is made in China doesn't automatically denote poor or lesser quality. My experience from seeing and actually using the newer webers is that they are still very high quality albeit expensive.
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I have to agree with this observation. The newer Weber Genesis 300 series definitely have a rust problem in the cart. The bottom and back should have been made of stainless. Also, the use of all caster wheels contributes to the bottom of the legs failing. See it all the time here in South Florida. So, you could argue that the quality has declined. On the other hand I personally really like my E-330 Special Edition and think it is definitely a great grill. I have seen the legs on the older Genesis versions also fail when they have casters. The open bottom of the legs with an axle and wheel allow better drainage. Anyway, even though I totally agree that Weber should go back to basics and make fewer models but all here in the US, I still can recommend them over the myriad of flashy but useless grills you see lined up at big box stores. Too soon to say about the Genesis II in my opinion. I do like that the legs appear to be improved. Having an option for all stainless frame would sure be nice, though.
 
I guess would add that features like electronic starters on each burner, stainless grates and flavorizer bars, larger size and stainless side tables all come at a price compared to the beautifully simple original Genesis. Whether the added complexity and features are worthwhile I suppose can only be answered a person at a time.

Interestingly, similar debates rage about classic cars. I would love to have a 1950s Hudson, but I also appreciate the comfort, reliability and modern features of my Honda van. Have cars become more complex, expensive and almost impossible to work on? Yes! But we seem to like the benefits they bring nonetheless. So I think you can appreciate classic Weber’s but also see positives in the newer models.
 
Greg M said:
Expensive doesn't elevate correlate to better. I'm guessing this is the better grade members mark you are talking about?

https://m.samsclub.com/ip/6-burner-gas-grill/prod20650624#

If you look in the frequently asked questions on the website regarding the grade of stainless it states low grade 430. There are also reviews stating problems with rust with this model.

No doubt it looks like it's a little better made than your standard char broil type grill. But IMO no way it lasts like a weber or broil king.
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At the Sam's where I shop the information plaques they put out for it consistently state 304SS is used in the construction. Also if there is such an aversion to 430SS then certainly lower end products i.e. Weber, Broil King, and so on should also be lumped into the same group. I have actually laid hands on both products (though in all fairness I did not bring a magnet) and looked closely at thickness of materials, overall construction, features and so on. Yes that Sam's has slightly less in features and slightly less in overall "look" of quality BUT $$$$ for $$$$ IMO it's every bit the equal if not the better ESPECIALLY when that lifetime warranty is thrown into the mix. And especially at WAY less than half the price (more like 1/3rd the price). I know I would most certainly take a chance on that $499 than spend $1200 or more on the Weber. If the Weber was made in USA of better material and better assembly quality then yeah even at $1200 plus I am all over it. Money is FAR too precious to NOT look at a purchase as I am. I am at a point where I no longer look at a purchase with my heart but with cold hard facts and $$ for $$ values. It's not just the price tag but how much that price tag will cost me. It's why I have not bought a new vehicle in over 30 years. Also why I look at what is the best vehicle over the long haul (pretty much why I am only driving Toyota products right now and daughter got a used Lexus). They cost more but I see the value there. I don't see the value of the Weber name on a new product any more. I did at one time. That's obvious since I had bought my Genesis II and in short order (about 10 years LOL) bought the Summit as a stable mate not as a replacement. Neither of those grills needed ANYTHING during their warranty period EXCEPT the most expensive one (the Summit) and what happened? Weber let me down. And what did Weber do when they let me down? Offer to sell me one of their Chinese products at a supposed discount (though when I actually thought about taking them up on it) I went to Home Depot to look at them and saw the (to me) disappointing quality and the fact I could have bought one cheaper through HD than through Weber at their so called courtesy discount! So yeah, Weber is NOT on a pedestal to me any more. Especially now with their new management.
I look at things with my head and my calculator now.
 
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Yah, when you see statements like "304SS used in construction" doesn't always mean what one would think. All it is saying is that there was SOME 304SS used in construction. It doesn't mean that all of the SS was 304SS. They aren't lying if the only 304SS is the cookbox bolt and the rest is 430SS because they did use 304SS in the construction of the grill.

It is like advertising for weight loss. Someone could say they lost 50 lbs using some diet pill or program or exercise gadget. Well, if they lose ten, put it back on in a month and lose it again, they have actually lost 20 pounds since using that product. But in total, they are only down ten.

Or a statement like "Customers have saved as much as 15% since switching to Gieco". It doesn't say you will or everyone did, just that at least one person did.

Can you tell I am a Skeptic by nature.
 
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I agree Bruce. I sincerely doubt the entire grill is 304 stainless. In fact I'll bet a lot or most of it isn't. And if the firebox or internals are low grade stainless then the grill won't last. There is a huge difference in using low grade stainless on the side shelves as opposed to the firebox and internals. The side shelves will likely just discolor. Not rust through like a firebox will when constantly exposed to high heat and moisture. This "premium" members mark grill is made by permasteel who also makes grills for walmart and also makes the lower priced members mark grills and I believe some of the kenmore grills. Not exactly a ringing endorsement. I'm currently on vacation but next time I'm in a Sam's I'll do a quick check with the magnet on my money clip and report back (if it is in stock).

Lmichaels I also believe in value for the dollar. That's precisely why I still believe in weber. I believe in what I see with my own eyes. I have a number of friends and / or family with weber grills. I'm the only one with a vintage weber. All of these are newer grills bought anywhere from 6 months to several years ago. All are performing well. All the owners rave about them as compared to their prior non weber grills. Not a single issue with any of these grills. 2 of these are even webers lower priced Spirits. I've helped cook on almost all of these and they are really just as good as my genesis 1000. Not quite as heavy duty as my 1000 or my silver A - but still very well made.

I'm sorry you got burned by Weber. But I think that is a very uncommon occurence.

I cringe when I think of all the money and aggravation I could have saved if I had bought a weber grill 25 years ago when my father bought his and tried to get me to buy one too. I would still be using that grill as I am now using my father's 25 year old grill instead of buying a parade of char broils, kenmores, etc. What a waste of money and time.

Lifetime warranty? I guess you are meaning Sam's satisfaction guarantee? The manufacturer permsteel only warrants that premium grill for 1 year. Probably for good reason. Would sams warranty really work 5 or 10 years down the road. Maybe. But then where would that grill go? To the landfill is where. How sad. To the landfill while most likely those chinese made webers would still be plugging along.
 
Also you don't have to spend $1200 on a new weber. The 3 burner genesis two that is similar in size to my 1000 is $699. It has the more durable open cart design. It's only when you add the enclosed cart and more burners that the price escalates. Three burners has always been enough room for me.
 
Greg, again you're assuming by looking at past Weber product (high quality materials and construction) that the new Chinese ones will be the same. I don't share the same faith in them. Especially when I consider the management company that took the company over and their corporate mission. Also even if the premium Sam's is only 430SS it does NOT mean it is a problem. Walk up to the Weber Summit say a 670S and put a magnet on it. It will be 430SS NOT 304. Look at how badly the products rust out in critical areas like the fire box because they're not even SS at all let alone 430 or 304. I don't have the same "blind faith" as you especially in a company that has sold it's soul (as it were) and like I said it will be a loooooong time before I buy another new grill again. Mostly thanks to how good my original Genesis was (still is) and the fact I have been able to keep my Summit going (despite being let down by Weber) and the fact I stumbled into the Wolf I have gracing my deck. So maybe the whole argument is moot. But honestly given what my eyes have seen and my hands have touched if a brand new grill was in my future it would be a pretty cold day down under if it was a Weber again. YMMV. I would rather have Sam's send one to the landfill and return my $$$ or replace the unit and save anywhere from $300 to $600
 
I see no reason for most people to worry about the future quality of Weber grills. There are sooo many of the 5-15 year old ones in circulation now, that there will always be those $50 used grills available for rehabbing. $50-$100 and a couple hours and you have a like new Genesis 3 burner Made in the USA.
 
I have sort of a related question, to the original question posted here regarding the temperature output of the newer Genesis grills, particularly the Genesis II LXS-440.

I'm looking to replace my tired Kenmore grill we have and used alot over the last 12 years. I've done some "refurbbing" to it and though I've not put that completely out of the realm of possibilities, I'm shopping around for a replacement. The Genesis LX has pretty much all of the features I'd like. Reading through this thread, I've also got concerns about is longevity, particularly if I shell out the better part of $1500 to get one. I bought my first Weber product this past summer, a 18.5 WSM smoker which we enjoy using, but we still grill far more than smoke. But I see some of what makes that a quality smoker, so that in part has me looking at Weber for a possible grill replacment

My primary question though has to do with the temperature output of the grill, especially it's high temp cooking ability. I read on another forum a review of the LXS-410. They raised some of the same questions regarding build quality and longevity, but the biggest disappointment that review listed was it high temperature "capabilities", and in particular is ability to sear meats like steaks and chops, pointing out older models of the Genesis seemed to perform better. On the surface this seems not that big a deal, but was disappointing to read those comments, which also called into question the "High Temperature" setting on the LX which to that reviewer, was just a marking on the plate behind the burner knob, not as it sounded like some sort of actual boost of the grill burners producing a higher temperature.

So I'm just simply asking for folks cooking experience with this grill. Any areas where it "falls short" or how does it cook overall.

Thanks.
 
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