High temp brisket


 
I'm ready to give this method a shot but would like to take some notes on how to cook 2 briskets using this method. From what I've gathered from the threads here are the differences:

1. Cook time will most likely increase from 4 hours to about 5 hours.
2. Foil the sides of the bottom grate to prevent high heat from drying out the sides of the brisket.

Any other suggestions for those that are trying 2 briskets at a time?
 
My understanding of the fast cook method requires a very high quality brisket like wagu or Kobe. They have far less connective tissues to break down.
No matter, the three ways to break up tough meat are low and slow. Connective tissue breaks down starting at 160. Collegen starts leaching out at 180. So the longer a cut of meat is in that zone, the better.
The second method is braising. The liquid stays at 212. Braising liquid protects the meat protiens while breaking down connective tissue. This works with brisket. Over done it turns brisket into mush.
The third is pressure cooking.
High Heat brisket is braising.
 
There is indeed a braising component to a cooking process that includes foiling.

High heat for brisket is more suitable for standard Choice, low-end Choice or Select. It will work okay for high-end Choice like CAB though.

Though it is certainly possible to high heat Kobe, Wagyu or Prime, these, imo, are best cooked lower and slower because they have more internal fat along with the connective tissue.

Connective tissue starts dissolving - and collagen gelatinizes - at lower temps. (This is why cooking tough cuts at low temps sous vide works well.)

Welcome to the board Tim.
 
Alright, here's my experience with my first high heat:

It was a 12 pound packer. I trimmed it up as I would my normal low and slow brisket, used my own rendition of Kevin Kruger's onion/garlic paste, then dusted liberally with rub. I used an almost full ring of unlit kingsford, with quite a few chunks of hickory on the top, and topped it all off with half a chimney of lit charcoal. The water pan was empty, topped with a foil-lined clay pot base. While I was preparing the brisket I allowed the smoker to get up to around 300 or so. When I put the brisket on I opened the door on the front about an inch and within 30-ish minutes it was up to 350. I closed/opened the door several times throughout the cook to keep it around 325-350 the entire time.

Right when the brisket hit 160 (around 2 hours) I foiled it with no additional liquid, being careful to leave a gap on the sides and top (I had to use two large pieces of foil, overlapped as best I could). I proceeded to cook it for another 2 hours, then started checking every 20 minutes for smooth probe entry (that's what she said), stabbing the middle of the flat. The first and second check met with resistance. After 4:40 total in the cooker (third check) it was still resisting that "smooth like butta" probe entry, but I took it off anyway, being mindful of overcooking it. I moved it directly to a cooler with blankets and let it sit for around 45 minutes.

When I opened the foil the first thing I noticed was that there wasn't as much juice as I thought there would be, only around a cup and a half. Perhaps I trimmed too much? The paste had left a nice tasty faux bark, so I was happy with that (thanks Kevin!). I was a little disappointed with the outcome of the slices themselves, as they were somewhat dry. A few of the very middle slices of the flat were good, but most were dryish. Now, I'm my own worst critic, as my wife said it was good (she has to say that), but what I'm shooting for is a good moist brisket that I can slice super thin for sandwiches (think juicy meat ribbons). This was definitely not the case for this brisket, as I had to cut the slices a good 1/3-1/2 inch to get them to stay together.

My guess is that my probe detection skills are way off and I was expecting the response to be truly "like butta", giving little to no resistance. While waiting for that perfect probe entry, I overcooked it. I suppose I should actually expect some resistance? My testing area included the approximate middle of the flat, stabbing from the top side at an angle.

As an aside, how do you handle the point after you've cooked the whole packer on high heat? I'd imagine it's not done yet.

Comments welcome! TIA.
 
My guess is that my probe detection skills are way off
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Maybe, although it sounds like you were hitting the right spot the right way. It is possible that (somewhat) overcooking occurred during the rest. Try not coolering nor wrapping. I rest, foil opened, tented, on the counter for 20 min or so. This allows excess heat to dissipate. At cooks this high overcooking can occur if tightly wrapped and coolered.

I'm glad you liked the paste.

The point is technically done, but 'done', regarding point can vary depending on the cook. I save high heat-cooked point for chili, sauces, fillings, etc. (I am not a fan of burnt ends but the point can be treated for such immediately and returned to the cooker.)
 
in doing these higher heat cooks, would it make sense to not use the minion methon and just light up the full ring of coal........seems that way you could get temp up easier without fussing so much.... but what the **** do i know
 
I don't fuss but, sure, you could. Some - maybe many - do. I much prefer the control of a Minion come-up, and the increased time the meat stays cooler
 
I'm contemplating a high heat brisket cook this weekend. I'm worried about selecting a good piece of meat. I have a Costco nearby but they only sell flats which is fine with me but how well do they hold up to the high heat? Also,they all just look really lean with very little fat or fat cap.

I am planning on following the kickassbbq.com technique for the quick cook beef brisket. I did a pork butt last weekend following his recipe and it came out pretty good. I did a small flat last year that came out horrible but I didn't do high heat. I'd hate to waste 4 or 5 hours and have it come out like crap again.
 
I think a packer is just too much meat. I only have 1 or 2 guests coming over and 13 lbs of brisket is overkill. Flats just seem more practical for my needs.
 
you can always vac and freeze leftovers....If your gonna light some coals my thought is to cook lots and freeze for sammies at later date....... enjoy
 
Many prefer just the flats. Not me. One, I cannot get good flats in many places I cook - they are all thin/overtrimmed. Ain't cookin' that. Two, the point helps the flat, imo, during cooking.

If you can get a packer, do. The excess can be frozen, as Corey notes, and can be reheated as is later, if you wish, or, my preference, turned into something else: finished in a flavorful braise, turned into chili, made into a sauce, etc.

That said, if you prefer just the flat, seek those that are not too small and not too trimmed and not thinly tapered. They work fine for HH cooks.
 
Originally posted by K Kruger:
Many prefer just the flats. Not me. One, I cannot get good flats in many places I cook - they are all thin/overtrimmed. Ain't cookin' that. Two, the point helps the flat, imo, during cooking.

If you can get a packer, do. The excess can be frozen, as Corey notes, and can be reheated as is later, if you wish, or, my preference, turned into something else: finished in a flavorful braise, turned into chili, made into a sauce, etc.

That said, if you prefer just the flat, seek those that are not too small and not too trimmed and not thinly tapered. They work fine for HH cooks.
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What sort of weight should I be targeting? Maybe a 5lb or 7lb? The last one I did (not high heat) was a tiny one (like 2.5 lbs) and it was very lean. Came out terrible.
 
Look at the shape and thickness. I'd go for a 6-lb thick flat with minimal trimming over a 8-lb flat that is overtrimmed and/or tapers dramatically to thinness. If the choice is between roughly equally thick flats go with the higher weight.

Thin, pieces of flats (like the 2.5-pounder you had) are more suitable to high heat cooking - but the timing is tighter. Best to temp the internal on something that samll and foil ~ 155, irrespective of how long it's cooked. Then check for done sooner than later. ... But try to avoid the little pieces.
 
Be careful of Costco. I just bought a couple of flats for this weekend, and they vary widely. They will usually put the fat cap down as well, so try to peek to see if they left enough. I got a couple that were more square-ish and uniform, and those tended to be the bigger ones they had. They also were packing two smaller ones in a single package, which I stayed away from...too thin, not uniform, too lean looking for my taste.

Edit: And don't forget, the yield on a full packer isn't 100%. A 13 lb packer might yield 7 lbs of meat when all is said and done. That may still be too much, but it freezes wonderfully.

Mine ended up being about 5 lbs apiece. If I didn't have company coming over (and had done a full packer before) I would have just gone for the whole brisket. And ask the butcher at Costco, they usually can accommodate whatever you need.
 
Originally posted by K Kruger:
Look at the shape and thickness. I'd go for a 6-lb thick flat with minimal trimming over a 8-lb flat that is overtrimmed and/or tapers dramatically to thinness. If the choice is between roughly equally thick flats go with the higher weight.

Thin, pieces of flats (like the 2.5-pounder you had) are more suitable to high heat cooking - but the timing is tighter. Best to temp the internal on something that samll and foil ~ 155, irrespective of how long it's cooked. Then check for done sooner than later. ... But try to avoid the little pieces.
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And if they all look fairly well trimmed? Should I ask the butcher for a less trimmed one? Is it possible to high heat a well trimmed brisket flat or will I just be wasting my time?
 
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