Any Prediction on Flavor?


 
G

Gene_N

TVWBB Fan
I'm 3 hrs into a 2 butt (12 lbs) smoke. I'm using the Southern Succor Rub and Southern Sop. I doubled the rub recipe and made the mistake of adding 4 tbls of dry mustard instead of 4 tsps. This is my first time using this rub and sop so I don't know what to expect either way. I hope the mustard overdose does not overpower.

Everything else is going well so far. My 22.5" is holding at 245-250F lid with 0/25/25 bottom vents; ET-732 temps are 138F int & 295 top grate. I just added 2L of water after starting with 4L. I used the minion method to start with a full chimney in the middle.

Almost perfect. :)
 
I think you'll be fine. I haven't tried that rub or sop, but in the course of a long butt cook dry mustard leaves no flavor that I ever noticed.:wsm:

Tim
 
It may change the taste a little, but I don't think it will ruin your cook. And, there is a bright side to your mistake. All of my rubs and sauces started out with basic recipes that I changed to suit my taste. You may like it better with the extra mustard. If you do, they're now YOUR rub and sop recipes!
 
It shouldn't alter the taste at all. Why mustard is put into Q recipes is beyond me, especially by those who should know better. Mustard's flavor is destroyed by heat.

Dry mustard has virtually no flavor to begin with. It needs liquid to activate the components that give it flavor. It does not work well in rubs for this reason. If, as could be the case, liquid is present on the surface of the meat in such quantity to activate the flavor, cooking will pretty much kill it. This is why mustard sauces are made either without heat or cooked at only low temps for short periods - well, good ones anyway. There's lots of recipes for mediocre mustard sauces out there, barbecue or otherwise.
 
When it's done and you decide whether "almost perfect" actually turns out to be perfect or if it doesn't, I'd be interested to know.
 
K Kruger said:
It shouldn't alter the taste at all. Why mustard is put into Q recipes is beyond me, especially by those who should know better. Mustard's flavor is destroyed by heat.

Dry mustard has virtually no flavor to begin with. It needs liquid to activate the components that give it flavor. It does not work well in rubs for this reason. If, as could be the case, liquid is present on the surface of the meat in such quantity to activate the flavor, cooking will pretty much kill it. This is why mustard sauces are made either without heat or cooked at only low temps for short periods - well, good ones anyway. There's lots of recipes for mediocre mustard sauces out there, barbecue or otherwise.
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Kevin, I will take your word for it. The rub recipe is featured in TVWB.com for a reason.

Dwain Pannell said:
When it's done and you decide whether "almost perfect" actually turns out to be perfect or if it doesn't, I'd be interested to know.
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Well, I was humming along until hour 6 when the lid temp dropped to 205F with int temp 169. I tapped the legs and opened the access door for 2 mins. Tapping dislodged a lot of ash but after 30 mins, the temp was at 200-205F so I pulled, flipped, mopped and moved it to my Genesis to finish off (lid 300F, grate 373F). Int temp dropped to 167 but after a hour, it's back to 172.

The now empty WSM is basked in the afternoon sun with a 220F lid temp. I used a full bag of KO and a full chimney to start. I'm glad I pulled it because I want to serve dinner at 6pm; hence the life of an impatient weekend smoker. :-)
 
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Well if there was an over-abundance of mustard flavor, my kids and I did not notice. I rested it for 75 mins then pulled/chopped for a 54% yield of "it tastes really good Dad" pulled pork. Good flavor & smoke ring, 1 butt was more tender than the other, the 2nd could have cooked another 30 mins. I froze two 1.5 lb bags, the remaining will be devoured this week. :)
 
Sounds like a "it tastes really good dad" success to me. I recommend making a few notes to keep what you want to and fix what you need to for the next time around.

I am concerned your WSM didn't last for the entire duration of a PP cook. Your WSM should last HOURS (as in all day). Chris has some good info about how to build a long lasting minion fire: http://virtualweberbullet.com/fireup2.html#minion he has an interesting comment in this article: "Depending on the weather and the amount of food being cooked, it may be necessary to add fuel after 12 hours of cooking."
 
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Dwain Pannell said:
Sounds like a "it tastes really good dad" success to me. I recommend making a few notes to keep what you want to and fix what you need to for the next time around.

I am concerned your WSM didn't last for the entire duration of a PP cook. Your WSM should last HOURS (as in all day). Chris has some good info about how to build a long lasting minion fire: http://virtualweberbullet.com/fireup2.html#minion he has an interesting comment in this article: "Depending on the weather and the amount of food being cooked, it may be necessary to add fuel after 12 hours of cooking."
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Dwain,

I read and reviewed the same URL you provided and watched many others on YouTube. I have 9 smokes under my belt; the longest my 22.5" has been able to sustain 225+ lid temps is 8 hours (Sept, mid 80s clear sky, light breeze). I used to be envious and wonder what I am doing wrong, what is wrong with my WSM and "it's not you it's me" mentality. I keep a smoking log and do take copious notes and readings.

I'm a weekend warrior. I consider myself a noob smoker/charcoal user but a very experienced gas griller. The latter created a short attention span so I've adapted. When WSM lid temps <210F, I lift and shift to my Genesis to finish off. This enables me to have morning smokes (not late night smokes which I have done), start the pita clean-up earlier (gas grilling spoiled me) and serve dinner at 6pm.

While I am a bit envious of people holding temps longer than 8 hours, no one in my house or neighborhood has complained about my lack of endurance... ;) As for flavor & meat tenderness? At the 6+ hour point and beyond, I believe it's more about holding a consistent cooking temp to hit your internal temp mark then resting for at least 1 hour before serving.

I was in Naperville, IL two weekends ago and went to Q-BBQ. They boasted in the menu they smoke their brisket 15 hours. It was good but I just don't have that kind of time....
 
Gene_N said:
Kevin, I will take your word for it. The rub recipe is featured in TVWB.com for a reason.
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When I write articles for The Virtual Weber Bullet that are inspired by or adapted from recipes I see in magazines or books, like The Renowned Mr. Brown pork butt recipe that comes from the book Smoke & Spice, I don't always know why every ingredient is in a recipe, or if a particular ingredient like dried mustard really makes a difference in the end product. My judgment is simply did I like the end result or not, and if I did, I may write about it on the website as something I tried and liked.

I would take Kevin at his word that the dried mustard in the recipe doesn't make any difference. However, next time I make that rub, I will probably include the dried mustard because...well, that's just what I do...I follow instructions as given in recipes. :)

Gene, it would be interesting to make some with and without the mustard and do a blind taste test, to see for yourself if you can taste any difference.

Regards,
Chris
 
I remembered this comment from a while back
K Kruger said:
...Dry mustard has virtually no flavor to begin with. It needs liquid to activate the components that give it flavor. It does not work well in rubs for this reason. ...
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when I read this (again) tonight; "A rub heavy with freshly ground mustard seed is a different story. In this rub, the pungent, tangy spice gives the ribs’ crusty outer layer a notable, zesty flavor."
--Rush, Colleen; Wiviott, Gary (2009-08-05). Low & Slow: Master the Art of Barbecue in 5 Easy Lessons (p. 127). Perseus Books Group. Kindle Edition.

Now I am completely confused. :confused:
 
Gene, I use a Sumeet. Spendy, but I use it often and don't only do dry grinding. I make a lot of pastes as well. However, I also use an Oxo manual (I don't think they make them anymore) and a dedicated coffee mill. If you don't go the Sumeet route I'd suggest a coffee mill.

Dwain, try Wiviott's recipe if you wish. He can barbecue but like many authors of barbecue books, he seems to have learned little of cooking, flavors, cooking science, among other things. The minds reels - but this is very common, especially in the barbecue niche. (I'd also note that "notable, zesty" is not necessarily mustard flavor. Were the flavor not to dissipate dramatically with cooking, a "rub heavy with..." would taste strongly of mustard. And that's only if it weren't affected by heat and substantially activated by liquid. The latter is possible in a rub, given sufficient surface moisture. But then there's the heat issue...)
 
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