Trying to Identify a Mystery Spice...


 
M

Matt B.

TVWBB Super Fan
To anybody with a good knowledge of spices:

Last week, I ate the best ribs I have ever tasted. In addition to being expertly well cooked, the ribs were seasoned with a glaze containing a spice that I cannot place. I had never tasted it before. Later in the week, I had some sauce at another restaurant that had a hint of the flavor in it. The restaurants were Pig on Beale in Memphis, TN and The Commissary, in Germantown, TN.

The flavor was completely unique (at least to my somewhat limited palette) and therefore is hard for me to describe. It reminded me of coffee, but it didn't really have the flavor of coffee. It was not a particularly savory taste, and neither was it sweet, bitter or sour. The flavor was smooth and robust, not sharp at all. In the glaze on the ribs, it was strong and dominant - it really made the ribs, in my opinion. In the sauce, it's flavor was still distinguishable and clear despite being in the presence of much stronger smells and tastes. It made what would be an otherwise ordinary sauce interesting. It was a flavor that you almost smelled more than tasted, but only when it was in your mouth. Kind of like how maple syrup is, at least for me.

I don't know if this makes any sense, but I'd really like you guys to take a stab at this thing. It's been bothering me all week. I can tell you it's not a spice you find at the average grocery store, because I've gone to three and smelled them all, in addition to what I have in my kitchen.
 
I'm thinking maybe Cardamom. It is a common pairing with meats in the middle east. Kind of savory, kind of sweet, and not used all that often stateside. It's flavor is unique, but I'm not sure if I would compare it to coffee (I'm trying some now with my morning brew). It can be found without too much effort, but usually not in your typical grocery.

Note to TravisH, go back to bed... It's even early here on the East coast!
 
Hmm. Like Rick I wouldn't describe cardamom as coffee-like either - not flavor-wise - but it does have similar qualities to its flavor volatiles. Another that comes to mind is fenugreek. Fenugreek has a rather maple-like flavor.

I use both in rubs quite often.

A spice described like this usually ends up being one of the warm, 'sweet' spices: allspice, nutmeg, clove, cinnamon (true, usually, or canela) cardamom, fenugreek, ginger, coriander, fennel (in smaller quantities), mace, and sometimes mahlab, amchur and sumac, though those three need pairings to deepen them.

Three other possibilities that aren't spices that are sometimes used as spices - I do: coffee, cocoa and vanilla.
 
this line " It was a flavor that you almost smelled more than tasted" really makes me think of cardamom.

In some areas of Jordan they actually put cardamom in their coffee and I have seen recipes for coffee/cardamom rubs.

Look for it in the pod (green pods) and use sparingly. Its a rather potent spice and it can become overwhelming. We use in a lot of Ethiopian curries (i think their spice mix is know as Berbare).
 
Larry wanted to add cardamom to one of my rib rub recipes and I made an amount suggestion here. At the beginning of the thread is the recipe.

Here, a blend that I used to top a paste rub, that includes cardamom; another dry rub I use to top a paste rub, this one including cardamom and coffee, here.

Recipes for berbere and baharat, both containing cardamom, here.
 
Thank you all very much for the replies. I didn't think this thread would have such a great response so quickly.

I'm almost 100% sure it's not actually coffee. I may have been wrong to describe it that way, but it does kind of hit you the same way coffee does.

Cardamom may be close. It doesn't smell like cardamom does in the container, but it may taste like it in a mix. I'll be getting some to experiment with. Thanks, Kevin, for the recipes.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">
A spice described like this usually ends up being one of the warm, 'sweet' spices: allspice, nutmeg, clove, cinnamon (true, usually, or canela) cardamom, fenugreek, ginger, coriander, fennel (in smaller quantities), mace, and sometimes mahlab, amchur and sumac, though those three need pairings to deepen them. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

It is definitely a spice of this family. My first guess was actually allspice. Nutmeg is another close one. It doesn't taste like either of those really, but it tastes similar to both of them, just as they taste similar to each other and the other spices you named.

I know it isn't allspice, nutmeg, clove, cinnamon, ginger, coriander, fennel, or sumac. That leaves cardamom, fenugreek, mace, mahlab, and amchur. This should be an adventure.

Thanks again, everybody, and if anything else comes to mind please shout it out! I'll keep this thread updated as I work through the list.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">but it may taste like it in a mix. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
The operative point, especially after cooking.

Like most spices, cardamom, fenugreek, et al., are rarely used in isolation. Each is most often combined with other spices, especially one or more 'sweet' spices, so that a deeper, broader flavor profile is achieved. Cooking alters this further.

You might try this, adding some cardamom to the mix as well. Might give you something to work off of.
 
OK, so I've bought some fenugreek and cardamom to try as well as some arrowroot, because it smelled kind of like what I was looking for.

I also bought an encyclopedia of herbs and spices. See the link below to the exact book. I'm not sure if this is a very good one or not, but this adventure has shown me how little I really know about spices. I figure this book will be as good a starting point as any.


http://www.amazon.com/gp/produ...0XB2ZKZ24D443AF8MK83
 
Hmmm. Arrowroot shouldn't have much of a smell. It's a starch used for thickening.

You should enjoy the book. Not a few home cooks (and even many pros) are intimidated by spices and herbs. I pretty much live for them. It's all about understanding their flavors, the results of various combinations, and how their flavors change, or not, during different types of cooking. How much or little one uses is important, but this comes after the fact. Using them - especially, at first, via recipes that others before you have created (it makes it easier) - will get you there. Have fun with it.
 
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