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to foil or not to foil...ribs are the question


 
C

chris kenney

New member
Doing ribs Sunday, i am thinking i will do half foiled and half unfoiled. Last time I did them, I foiled due to time constraints and the ribs were fall-off-the bone (at higher temps). What are the pros/cons of each method?

I will be doing St. Louis ribs (un-enhanced) with water pan full of water shooting for 225 temps at lid with kingsford and using plum wood. Also, thinking of shooting them with pineapple juice (new one for me).

Thanks in advance for your input.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by chris kenney:
Doing ribs Sunday, i am thinking i will do half foiled and half unfoiled. Last time I did them, I foiled due to time constraints and the ribs were fall-off-the bone (at higher temps). What are the pros/cons of each method?

I will be doing St. Louis ribs (un-enhanced) with water pan full of water shooting for 225 temps at lid with kingsford and using plum wood. Also, thinking of shooting them with pineapple juice (new one for me).

Thanks in advance for your input. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Hello Chris, if you use the search function and look for foil and ribs you will find lots of posts asking about it.

You can foil with or without extra liquid like juice. Foiling speeds things up a bit and helps to soften the ribs, but you can easily turn the ribs to mush using foil.

Foiling, particularly with liquid can affect the appeareance (mainly the rub) and outside texture as well. You can't get the color back but you can roll the ribs around on a grill after foiling to get a nice crispy external texture.

Irrespective of foil, at too low a temp the ribs can dry out before they get tender.

As a guideline, I'll suggest you keep the smoker between 250 - 275 at the lid. If you use foil limit time to 1 hour max for small back ribs and 2 hours max for huge spares. See what you think and adjust from there for your own preference.

Happy q'ing!
 
I don't see the point in cooking ribs that low but you can if you want. To me, low/slow ribs work better at a temp of 250 lid, give or take 10 degrees. (I do spares at ~275-285 grate--a personal preference.)

The pro, to me, is that I can add another flavor layer. I often use a little pineapple juice mixed with strong tamarind in the foil. I don't find that ribs take all that long (relatively speaking) so the use of foil to shorten the cook isn't an issue for me; some would find that a 'pro'.

I don't always foil. When I do, it is never by time. It is after the ribs are very deeply colored. Then I foil (with the little bit of juice) and cook till tender while the ribs are foiled. Then I remove the ribs and return them to the cooker for 5-10 min to firm nicely. Sometimes I paint on a very thin veneer of glaze. I never sauce.

The con, to me, would be if the ribs went too long in the foil. Fall-off-the-bone is overcooked to me, and I dislike that. But cooking substantially first, before foiling, then foiling just till tender avoids this. It also sets the color and the bark texture so neither are lost due to the foil.

I don't really see a pro nor con with not foiling but, again, I don't foil for texture or shorter cook time. I foil to add a flavor layer when I want that, which isn't all the time. It depends on the rub I've made, whatever sauces I'm making, and what I am serving the ribs with.
 
Wow Kevin, what a confusing contrast in opinions. How is your 250 lid any different than my 250 lid? As for color change, if you want to change the color of your ribs in foil try adding purple grape juice ... lovely grey product.

I can't understand how to manage heat loss opening the WSM every so often to check the tenderness of your ribs in foil since we aren't going by time but you suggest cooking by feel. Regardless of if it's your intention or not foiling tenderizes ribs. If left too long they will be mush. Not only mush, but more mushy than they could be outside of foil.

Chris, I should have added to my first post that for a starting point I suggest you don't foil for more than 1 hour.
 
Yes! Foil or not foil. Either one works. Unfoiled just takes a bit longer.

Shawn, I think Kevin was referring to the <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">I will be doing St. Louis ribs (un-enhanced) with water pan full of water shooting for 225 temps at lid with kingsford and using plum wood. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Chris mentioned.
 
First, Shawn, I don't cook at 250 lid, as I stated. Were I to do that it would certainly be the same. My reference was to Chris and his mention of cooking at 225 lid in the OP, not to you (we posted at virtually the same time--I didn't see your post at that time). [Correct John.]

I did see your post after I posted and edited mine to offer an opposing opinion about foiling vis-a-vis appearance. If the color is well established then foiling will not affect it. Foiling later during the process (when the ribs have deep color) does this. Got this from J Minion a while back. Further, it won't really affect the texture either if the ribs are returned unfoiled to the cooker for a few minutes.

Lastly, I don't open the cooker 'every so often to check the tenderness'. That is totally unnecessary. And I do not open the foil till the ribs are done. The foiling stage is nearly always finished--i.e., the ribs are done--within a 10-minute window of a set time. I check once at around the beginning of when I know that window will be--just lift the lid straight up and poke the ribs through the foil; if done, I pull them; if not, they will be in probably 7-12 minutes. I check in 10. If done, I pull; if not, I leave alone a few minutes then pull them without checking because I know they'll be done.

The notion that every rack of ribs is somehow 'different' is a myth so endless checking is unnecessary. Establish base cooking criteria that work for you and your tastes and the ribs will cook nearly the same each time, a few minutes variance, tops, either way--maybe. I can easily live with that.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Shawn W:
Hello Chris, if you use the search function and look for foil and ribs you will find lots of posts asking about it.

You can foil with or without extra liquid like juice. Foiling speeds things up a bit and helps to soften the ribs, but you can easily turn the ribs to mush using foil.

Foiling, particularly with liquid can affect the appeareance (mainly the rub) and outside texture as well. You can't get the color back but you can roll the ribs around on a grill after foiling to get a nice crispy external texture.

Irrespective of foil, at too low a temp the ribs can dry out before they get tender.

As a guideline, I'll suggest you keep the smoker between 250 - 275 at the lid. If you use foil limit time to 1 hour max for small back ribs and 2 hours max for huge spares. See what you think and adjust from there for your own preference.

Happy q'ing! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Shawn I was going to add my .02 to this post, but you said EXACTLY what I was going to add! Great advice!!
icon_biggrin.gif
 
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by John Mason:
Yes! Foil or not foil. Either one works. Unfoiled just takes a bit longer.

Shawn, I think Kevin was referring to the <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">I will be doing St. Louis ribs (un-enhanced) with water pan full of water shooting for 225 temps at lid with kingsford and using plum wood. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Chris mentioned. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Doh. You're right John, post times 8:39 & 8:37, we were writing at the same time. I thought KK was resonding to my post. Sorry KK.
 
alright...foiling sounds like an un-necassary thing that can only mess up my cook...unless i need to speed things up. I will stick to foil-less ribs unless i feel the need for speed!

Thanks for the advice on the temps as well...250 is just as easy to keep as 225.

I have read on here about pineapple juice in a spray bottle, this intrigues me...would spraying at the half's be enough for desired effect???

thanks,

Chris
 
No, not in my opinion. You need to spray very frequently for it to have a flavor impact. One thing you can do though is to concentrate the flavor first. This eliminates much of the water that is diluting the flavor you're trying to add. You can simmer juice on the stove till it reduces by enough to concentrate the flavor--but not enough so that it is unsprayable.

I don't like going through that nor the spraying motions so either I foil with juice or just simply make a thin juice-based glaze to apply for the last few minutes of cooking. For a pineapple one, reduce about 3/4 c of pineapple juice in a small pot on the stove over medium heat till it is reduced by 3/4 or a bit more and it thicker and syrupy. Add to the syrup about a tsp of unsalted butter a tsp or two of honey and/or a tsp or two of brown sugar. Mix well, let the sugar or honey dissolve completely. You want the glaze on the thick side but paintable. Keep warm, off heat, till use.

When your ribs are done or nearly there, use a pastry brush to apply the glaze very thinly over the ribs. Thinly applied, you'll get the flavor but it won't mar the exterior finish of the meat the way applied sauce can. Let the ribs cook a few minutes so that the glaze will seize. If desired, paint on another thin coat, let it tighten and dry for a few. Done.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by chris kenney:
alright...foiling sounds like an un-necassary thing that can only mess up my cook...unless i need to speed things up. I will stick to foil-less ribs unless i feel the need for speed!

Chris </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Chris,
Foiling "can" mess up your cook, but only if done for too long. However, foil can be a very, very useful tool and will provide consistent results with your cooks, especially ribs if done properly. Sure you can consistently cook ribs with great results without foil, but foil can be an aid as well. Try them both ways with Shawns suggested time and temps and then go by what method works best for you.

Pineapple juice is a great addition to ribs. However make sure you do not use fresh or frozen pineapple juice, bottled or canned is fine. Pineapple juice contains the enzyme 'bromelain' which is a natural meat tenderizer and if left on too long it will make thin cuts of meat mushy all the way through and thicker cuts mushy on the outside. Bottle and canned pineapple juice is fine because the bromelain is destroyed during the canning process.
 
Good points, Larry.

You only need to heat fresh juice to inactivate the enzyme so if you only have fresh, my usual, heat it first to a simmer. That'll do it. (Ditto for papain, the enzyme in papaya.)
 
When to foil:

I foil when I see meat starting to pull back from the bone ends, bone ends are getting dark ... exterior flesh color is getting dark but when twisting at the ribs it still feels a bit too firm.

In my experience this is usually around the 3-4 hour mark for backs and 4 - 5 hours for spares.
 
UPDATE: I got nervous about my cutoff time and foiled for less than 1 hour and the ribs pulled back too far again (bones came out of the meat). They were still good and i was the only one that knew they were overdone. (I cooked at 220 for 4 hours, then foiled for 50 minutes at 250, then another 45 minutes unfoiled at 250)

I used an old standby rub that I had and milded it down a bit with extra brown sugar and no red pepper since we had guests coming over. Between four kids, they all ate ribs, three of them getting seconds, so that was good.

I also used the pineapple juice baste, I am not sure what that got me though. I doubt I will do that again next time. While a more advanced pallet might have been able to tell, I think it was an added expense and effort for not much return...plus it made me worry about whether I was extending my cook time (reason i foiled).

Anyways, another successful cook on the WSM, and I learned something along the way. Thanks for your help, fellow Q'ers!

Chris
 
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