Pork Butt Injections.
- Thread starter JeffB
- Start date
Brian Staley
TVWBB Fan
I have not done it yet. But I have Myrons book and have thought about doing it. I am sure many people here will say you don't need to, but you know what,Myron wins. And wins big. So I figure it couldn't hurt to try it out. I have cooked 40 or 50 butts in the last few years, time to try something new.
Russ Sylvester
TVWBB Pro
Necessary? No.
Does it work? I believe so.
I've been using a mixture of:
2 cups Apple Juice
1 cup Apple cider vinegar
1 Tbsp Worcestershire
1 Tbsp Corn Syrup
Try to get it evenly injected. Resist making a huge 'pocket' right in the middle.
Russ
Does it work? I believe so.
I've been using a mixture of:
2 cups Apple Juice
1 cup Apple cider vinegar
1 Tbsp Worcestershire
1 Tbsp Corn Syrup
Try to get it evenly injected. Resist making a huge 'pocket' right in the middle.
Russ
Kaz S
TVWBB Pro
Russ, that sounds real good. Do yomix in any rub with that?
I was thinking of adding a few Tbls of something like this to the injection:
•4 tablespoons chili powder
•1/2 teaspoon cayenne pepper
•1 1/2 teaspoon black pepper
•2 1/2 teaspoons garlic powder
Also,
Does anyone add in a teaspoon of tenderquick to their injection to get some pink deep in the meat?
I was thinking of adding a few Tbls of something like this to the injection:
•4 tablespoons chili powder
•1/2 teaspoon cayenne pepper
•1 1/2 teaspoon black pepper
•2 1/2 teaspoons garlic powder
Also,
Does anyone add in a teaspoon of tenderquick to their injection to get some pink deep in the meat?
MKEvenson
TVWBB Wizard
I have been injecting my butts for a year now. I do so in the comp meats and also at home, since my cooks at home are practice for comps.
I use Kosmos Pork injection. Instead of water I use a pork stock made from pork base that I get from soupbase.com
https://www.soupbase.com/view.asp.
I add apple jelly and a bit of sugar also per Myrons injection recipe, although perhaps not the pork.
I also add a bit of salt and a bit of Kosmos Magic, I like magic.
Unlike Kosmos brisket injection which I dilute a bit from the package instructions, I use the pork injection as per the ratios on the bag.
I have tried Lilly's pork injection and Myron's recipe, but am pretty sold on Kosmos. I bet Butchers is just as good but a bit more pricy.
Mark
I use Kosmos Pork injection. Instead of water I use a pork stock made from pork base that I get from soupbase.com
https://www.soupbase.com/view.asp.
I add apple jelly and a bit of sugar also per Myrons injection recipe, although perhaps not the pork.
I also add a bit of salt and a bit of Kosmos Magic, I like magic.
Unlike Kosmos brisket injection which I dilute a bit from the package instructions, I use the pork injection as per the ratios on the bag.
I have tried Lilly's pork injection and Myron's recipe, but am pretty sold on Kosmos. I bet Butchers is just as good but a bit more pricy.
Mark
Bob Miller
TVWBB Member
you may need to watch your spices/rub depending on your injector. Mine clogs easily so I've been sticking to the apple juice / cider vinegar / worce as a base.
I've only made a handful and have injected every time. I've had good results with moist sweet pork every time.
I've only made a handful and have injected every time. I've had good results with moist sweet pork every time.
K Kruger
TVWBB 1-Star Olympian
It never ceases to amaze me that phosphates pass muster at comps. I realize that the judging is pretty simplistic and profiles are narrow and unsophisticated but the level of adulteration allowed is stunning, especially since it so obvious in the finished product.
Anyway, no, injecting is not required. It is very easy to adjust moisture/texture/flavor during pulling if you wish.
Anyway, no, injecting is not required. It is very easy to adjust moisture/texture/flavor during pulling if you wish.
Russ Sylvester
TVWBB Pro
Yes, I do usually add a tablespoon or two of rub into the mix. I generally will mix it up a day or two in advance to let it 'season' a bit in the fridge. Then either strain out the rub solids or just be sure not to stir up the mud on the bottom. They tend to either plug up the injector or they make clumps in the meat.
That way whatever rub I'm using on the outside matches what's on the inside.
Russ
That way whatever rub I'm using on the outside matches what's on the inside.
Russ
MKEvenson
TVWBB Wizard
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by K Kruger:
It never ceases to amaze me that phosphates pass muster at comps. I realize that the judging is pretty simplistic and profiles are narrow and unsophisticated but the level of adulteration allowed is stunning, especially since it so obvious in the finished product.
Anyway, no, injecting is not required. It is very easy to adjust moisture/texture/flavor during pulling if you wish. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Kevin, it would be interesting if all comp judges had your palate. Unfortunately I don't and tend to go with what works both for me and others in the comp world. Not so sure that moisture retaining substances used during the cooking process are all that objectionable especially when the judges, I am one also, have comparatively uneducated palates relative to an acomplished chef like yourself.
I understand more clearly why you don't go in for competative BBQ.
Mark
It never ceases to amaze me that phosphates pass muster at comps. I realize that the judging is pretty simplistic and profiles are narrow and unsophisticated but the level of adulteration allowed is stunning, especially since it so obvious in the finished product.
Anyway, no, injecting is not required. It is very easy to adjust moisture/texture/flavor during pulling if you wish. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Kevin, it would be interesting if all comp judges had your palate. Unfortunately I don't and tend to go with what works both for me and others in the comp world. Not so sure that moisture retaining substances used during the cooking process are all that objectionable especially when the judges, I am one also, have comparatively uneducated palates relative to an acomplished chef like yourself.
I understand more clearly why you don't go in for competative BBQ.
Mark
Dave from Denver
TVWBB Wizard
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by K Kruger:
It never ceases to amaze me that phosphates pass muster at comps. I realize that the judging is pretty simplistic and profiles are narrow and unsophisticated but the level of adulteration allowed is stunning, especially since it so obvious in the finished product. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I tried the butchers BBQ pork injection and the result was pretty disgustingly artificial-tasting to me. The brisket, however, was amazing with the same company's injection. Your mileage may vary I guess.
It never ceases to amaze me that phosphates pass muster at comps. I realize that the judging is pretty simplistic and profiles are narrow and unsophisticated but the level of adulteration allowed is stunning, especially since it so obvious in the finished product. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I tried the butchers BBQ pork injection and the result was pretty disgustingly artificial-tasting to me. The brisket, however, was amazing with the same company's injection. Your mileage may vary I guess.
Kevin, while I think what you said is very true, it's nice to see the judging at BBQ comps isn't as simplistic and narrow as that at chili comps. IMO, the fact you can get away with altering the meat is at least some "freedom" to do something different.
But then again, at least at chili comps, the frame of mind is so narrow, that you HAVE to produce quality within a standard.
I know, this thread has nothing to do with chili comps...just throwing out a couple of cents.
But then again, at least at chili comps, the frame of mind is so narrow, that you HAVE to produce quality within a standard.
I know, this thread has nothing to do with chili comps...just throwing out a couple of cents.
I've graduated from low/slow to high heat and even recently (out of necessity) cooked a frozen butt. All rubbed, a few early ones mopped, and a few injected. I haven't noticed a great difference in quality or flavor between any of the butts from the injection or mopping.
The greatest leap forward in my PP has been from using Kevin's finishing sauce and coming up with better sauces for the sandwiches.
The greatest leap forward in my PP has been from using Kevin's finishing sauce and coming up with better sauces for the sandwiches.
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by K Kruger:
...
Anyway, no, injecting is not required. It is very easy to adjust moisture/texture/flavor during pulling if you wish. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Hi Kevin,
Can you elaborate on that or point me to a thread or resource that describes this?
I don't inject and some times I sprinkle a little water on the pulled pork before I refrigerate it. (I smoke a lot more than we can eat and refrigerate and freeze the left overs.) Some times I sauce when I reheat it or sprinkle a little cider vinegar on at that time.
I'm curious what others are doing.
I'm not competing, but if I can learn a thing or two that will improve my results, I will!
...
Anyway, no, injecting is not required. It is very easy to adjust moisture/texture/flavor during pulling if you wish. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Hi Kevin,
Can you elaborate on that or point me to a thread or resource that describes this?
I don't inject and some times I sprinkle a little water on the pulled pork before I refrigerate it. (I smoke a lot more than we can eat and refrigerate and freeze the left overs.) Some times I sauce when I reheat it or sprinkle a little cider vinegar on at that time.
I'm curious what others are doing.
I'm not competing, but if I can learn a thing or two that will improve my results, I will!
K Kruger
TVWBB 1-Star Olympian
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">But then again, at least at chili comps, the frame of mind is so narrow, that you HAVE to produce quality within a standard. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Would that that were the case. While I'll agree that the judging at chili comps is narrow, I won't agree on 'quality'. Here's a perfect example of what passes for quality. Virtually all packaged pre-made stuff except the meat. Other so-called winning recipes are similar. Sorry: yuck.
Mark- It wouldn't be all that difficult but no one is into it, least of all KCBS. It doesn't take being a chef and it doesn't take palate sophistication to begin with. What it would take is easily taught. Sure judges go for chemically altered meat - they are used to it - it's the American way. I think that it is allowed (let alone wins) is a poor reflection on how judges are trained, if one can call it that at all, on KCBS, and on the spirit of competition (many that would not have been forced to adopt meat adulterations to compete). No I do not compete. I have helped many competitors and comp teams over the years, when asked. I like the idea of comps very much. I just don't think most of barbecue competition is well thought out or well done. And I think that is unfortunate.
Would that that were the case. While I'll agree that the judging at chili comps is narrow, I won't agree on 'quality'. Here's a perfect example of what passes for quality. Virtually all packaged pre-made stuff except the meat. Other so-called winning recipes are similar. Sorry: yuck.
Mark- It wouldn't be all that difficult but no one is into it, least of all KCBS. It doesn't take being a chef and it doesn't take palate sophistication to begin with. What it would take is easily taught. Sure judges go for chemically altered meat - they are used to it - it's the American way. I think that it is allowed (let alone wins) is a poor reflection on how judges are trained, if one can call it that at all, on KCBS, and on the spirit of competition (many that would not have been forced to adopt meat adulterations to compete). No I do not compete. I have helped many competitors and comp teams over the years, when asked. I like the idea of comps very much. I just don't think most of barbecue competition is well thought out or well done. And I think that is unfortunate.
K Kruger
TVWBB 1-Star Olympian
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Can you elaborate on that or point me to a thread or resource that describes this? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Sure.
I use this most often as a finishing sauce. I add it at a rate of 2-3 tablespoons per handful pulled pork (around 1-2 tablespoons per cup). Unlike typical serving sauces (though you can use this as one as well) this sauce in not at all thick, and contains simple yet key flavor elements and some fat that go along way to making what I think are important adjustments to the finish.
This finishing sauce, mixed in, evens out textures and flavors. When the meat is served, it works well with nearly any other sauces you might serve alongside (or on) the pork.
You can make changes to this sauce or make one up on your own. What I think are the key properties (and thus those to utilize) are that it is thin, that it contains some fat, and that it is emulsified.
Some sweetness, as is in mine, is fine. I'd strongly caution you to avoid much sugar or other sweeteners should you make your own. Sweeteners, especially sugar, flattens flavors, removing any breadth (the high flavor notes, especially) from the flavor profile. A lot of sweet means the flavors will be muddy; not only will there be no breadth but the depth will vanish as well.
Depth and breadth won't win in a comp. But I am often asked by non-comp cooks what they can do to up their game in terms of their flavor profile. Other than getting rid of the wasted ingredients in a rub (paprika and dry mustard) which should be done, imo, my answer is always 'decrease the sugar'. Doing so opens flavor doors that were unseen before, and, imo, significantly allows for not only more and better placed creativity, but really lets the effort put into the cook speak for itself.
Sure.
I use this most often as a finishing sauce. I add it at a rate of 2-3 tablespoons per handful pulled pork (around 1-2 tablespoons per cup). Unlike typical serving sauces (though you can use this as one as well) this sauce in not at all thick, and contains simple yet key flavor elements and some fat that go along way to making what I think are important adjustments to the finish.
This finishing sauce, mixed in, evens out textures and flavors. When the meat is served, it works well with nearly any other sauces you might serve alongside (or on) the pork.
You can make changes to this sauce or make one up on your own. What I think are the key properties (and thus those to utilize) are that it is thin, that it contains some fat, and that it is emulsified.
Some sweetness, as is in mine, is fine. I'd strongly caution you to avoid much sugar or other sweeteners should you make your own. Sweeteners, especially sugar, flattens flavors, removing any breadth (the high flavor notes, especially) from the flavor profile. A lot of sweet means the flavors will be muddy; not only will there be no breadth but the depth will vanish as well.
Depth and breadth won't win in a comp. But I am often asked by non-comp cooks what they can do to up their game in terms of their flavor profile. Other than getting rid of the wasted ingredients in a rub (paprika and dry mustard) which should be done, imo, my answer is always 'decrease the sugar'. Doing so opens flavor doors that were unseen before, and, imo, significantly allows for not only more and better placed creativity, but really lets the effort put into the cook speak for itself.
Kevin,
Thank you for taking the time to answer my question. That sounds like a great recipe and I'll be using it - at the least as a starting point - the next time I smoke pulled pork. I'm in the same camp as you WRT sweetness. I tried the BRITU recipe and while the ribs came out very good, they were just too sweet compared to what I am accustomed to. (I don;t put mustard in my rubs and I will swap out some ancho powder for paprika too.)
thanks,
hank
Thank you for taking the time to answer my question. That sounds like a great recipe and I'll be using it - at the least as a starting point - the next time I smoke pulled pork. I'm in the same camp as you WRT sweetness. I tried the BRITU recipe and while the ribs came out very good, they were just too sweet compared to what I am accustomed to. (I don;t put mustard in my rubs and I will swap out some ancho powder for paprika too.)
thanks,
hank
K Kruger
TVWBB 1-Star Olympian
Chris E
TVWBB Pro
A note on color and competition--_KCBS rules instruct CBJs to not judge based on smoke ring or pink color as this can be induced artificially. It takes discipline as a judge to ignore a nice smoke ring on brisket slices since we all like to see see that on our on Q.
I like to add sauce after becuase I can use different sauces for different folks on the same cook--i.e. those that are sugar-averse or hot vs mild. I like to have several sauces for use on the pork.
I like to add sauce after becuase I can use different sauces for different folks on the same cook--i.e. those that are sugar-averse or hot vs mild. I like to have several sauces for use on the pork.