RalphTrimble
TVWBB Diamond Member
look at your solder spool, maybe you have lead free silver solder anyways? I would personally just skip over the soldering all together and go with press fit.
my air burner build
- Thread starter Johannes S
- Start date
Johannes S
TVWBB Member
guys you frigthen me a bit. had a sleepless night and googled a lot. yes. lead is poisonous and no fun to deal with.
but it starts to boil at 1100C. no way that some lead can be "washed out" from the air burner and get in contact with food.
well. at least this is what i hope. i wanted to hard solder the whole thing with silver solder, but my oxygen bottle is empty.
so i used regular solder. my fault.
i still can get some non lead solder and do it again.
but for now i have to use what i have because this weekend is bbq time. what do you think: is there a big risk to use what i made? i don't think so. but if someone who is a professional KNOWS for sure that this is a no-go, please let me know.
i don't want to offend you guys that told me that it's a bad idea! no way! i appreciate your advice and your concerns about my health - and you made me think about it. thanks for that, but i want to understand better how it could be a thread.
but it starts to boil at 1100C. no way that some lead can be "washed out" from the air burner and get in contact with food.
well. at least this is what i hope. i wanted to hard solder the whole thing with silver solder, but my oxygen bottle is empty.
so i used regular solder. my fault.i still can get some non lead solder and do it again.
but for now i have to use what i have because this weekend is bbq time. what do you think: is there a big risk to use what i made? i don't think so. but if someone who is a professional KNOWS for sure that this is a no-go, please let me know.
i don't want to offend you guys that told me that it's a bad idea! no way! i appreciate your advice and your concerns about my health - and you made me think about it. thanks for that, but i want to understand better how it could be a thread.
Dave Smith
TVWBB Super Fan
I used regular solder on mine.........it's not like the joints are going to melt each time you use it, as it sits under the grate not above it in the charcoal; besides if you read everything is bad for you. It's your call on it.
Johannes S
TVWBB Member
@dave: just what i thought. not that i thought about it before, but i can't see any way how the lead can get in contact with the food. as i said: lead will boil at 1.100C (2.000F). i guess the solder will not even melt.
never the less i ordered some silver solder (55% solder, no lead) which is approved for food appliances. cutting the copper rod and building it was an hour work, so i can redo it easily.
yesterday i did a test run. and the result was very bad. this may have had several reasons:
-) i only used about 3/4 of a coal heater (or what ever they are called) as i didn't have any briquettes left.
-) then i filled the water pan, and then i moved the WSM a bit, and some of the water spilled over the non lit coal
-) making the mess burn was an nightmare. i used 5 lighters to make it burn.
-) even at 100% the fan didn't produce much of an airflow. opening all 3 vents made the heat rise more. i'm not sure if this is necessary in regular operation mode.
so i hope that it didn't reach 110C because at no time there was enough coal lit. i bought some coal today (20kg) and will try another dry run. i hope it works better this time.
i also hope the the 10cfm fan, reduced to 12mm ID of the copper rod with 16x 3mm holes produces enough air flow to make the fire hot enough. we'll see this evening
never the less i ordered some silver solder (55% solder, no lead) which is approved for food appliances. cutting the copper rod and building it was an hour work, so i can redo it easily.
yesterday i did a test run. and the result was very bad. this may have had several reasons:
-) i only used about 3/4 of a coal heater (or what ever they are called) as i didn't have any briquettes left.
-) then i filled the water pan, and then i moved the WSM a bit, and some of the water spilled over the non lit coal
-) making the mess burn was an nightmare. i used 5 lighters to make it burn.
-) even at 100% the fan didn't produce much of an airflow. opening all 3 vents made the heat rise more. i'm not sure if this is necessary in regular operation mode.
so i hope that it didn't reach 110C because at no time there was enough coal lit. i bought some coal today (20kg) and will try another dry run. i hope it works better this time.
i also hope the the 10cfm fan, reduced to 12mm ID of the copper rod with 16x 3mm holes produces enough air flow to make the fire hot enough. we'll see this evening
Johannes S
TVWBB Member
hmmm. i just ain't work. the WSM 18.5 just won't heat up enough. fan is running 100% all the time. i reduced fan max to 40% as recommended, but the temp will just not hold the max set. i now set fan output to 100% (after having tried all from 50-60-70%) and we'll see.
maybe the briquettes used are not the best - for sure not as hot as the weber long lasting premium stuff.
i would like to have the fan turn on/off as needed, but it runs 100% all the time
maybe the briquettes used are not the best - for sure not as hot as the weber long lasting premium stuff.
i would like to have the fan turn on/off as needed, but it runs 100% all the time
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Johannes S
TVWBB Member
seems i got it dialed in. top vent is almost 2/3 closed. fan is set to 100%. PID 10,0.05,5.
we'll see what it looks like in 2 hours.
is it better to have to top vent open or closed? i read of having it open to just insert a toothpick? but this was for a green egg.
closing it so much seems to me it would kill the fire at all?!
we'll see what it looks like in 2 hours.
is it better to have to top vent open or closed? i read of having it open to just insert a toothpick? but this was for a green egg.
closing it so much seems to me it would kill the fire at all?!
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RalphTrimble
TVWBB Diamond Member
Looks like the fire isn't getting enough air then...What size copper pipe are you using (at the smallest point if you have several sizes). You never posted a pic showing the holes in the air burner, so I am commenting blind.... but I would suggest you probably need more/bigger holes to allow more air through.
Johannes S
TVWBB Member
the tube is 12mm ID and there are 16 holes of 3mm (1/8") which equals the area of 12mm (1/2") diameter. i opened 6 holes of the to 4mm.
i will try with bigger holes tomorrow.
edit: it could be the coal as well. it heats up no bad, but i need to remove ash and stir it up every hour or so, or it will loose temperature. i should try again with weber briquettes.
i will try with bigger holes tomorrow.
edit: it could be the coal as well. it heats up no bad, but i need to remove ash and stir it up every hour or so, or it will loose temperature. i should try again with weber briquettes.
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Johannes S
TVWBB Member
and down it went ....
i will now make bigger holes and test again
i will now make bigger holes and test again
Johannes S
TVWBB Member
i made bigger holes. the one nearest to exit being the smallest ones (3mm) and then becoming bigger and bigger up to 5mm.
the result looks quite good. this is w/o any bbq in it. it's a pure test run, with no smoking wood added. the temp decline at the end, and the 105° shown are due to the fire going out. after i added coal it went on like before.
and this picture shows the final result. as you can see: the heat WILL make the regular solder melt (or at least become soft). i already ordered silver solder and will re-do the job next week.
the first test with some pulled pork looks like that:
the result looks not bad to me. but i'm not really happy. the air burner and massively increased pid settings of 15,0.02,5 made the overshoot go away almost completely, but there are still some things that don't look 100% perfect to me:
-) from the beginning to 23:00 i added one fist sized piece of beech wood every hour (3 times). this made the temperature go out of control it seems. the wood started to smoke, and after some time the temperature of the pit raised w/o air added (fan 0%).
-) at around 00:10 i added the pulled pork, that where the spikes come from, i guess this is ok
-) no idea what happened around 02:00??
-) at around 03:30 the fire went out. and this i don't understand. the coal ring was filled fully with briquettes. and the fire was started right in the middle.but still there is only one side burned down, and fresh coal on the other side which didn't get lit. no idea why, i thought the air burner would help here as well as it provides fresh air over the whole grate. i had to get up and relocate some coal.
-) same procedure as above today at 09:00.
would it be better to make a coal ring and let it burn down from one end to the other? (minion method)
edit: and another question: even if i set "fan min" to 20% it still goes out completely. why it that?
the result looks quite good. this is w/o any bbq in it. it's a pure test run, with no smoking wood added. the temp decline at the end, and the 105° shown are due to the fire going out. after i added coal it went on like before.
and this picture shows the final result. as you can see: the heat WILL make the regular solder melt (or at least become soft). i already ordered silver solder and will re-do the job next week.
the first test with some pulled pork looks like that:
the result looks not bad to me. but i'm not really happy. the air burner and massively increased pid settings of 15,0.02,5 made the overshoot go away almost completely, but there are still some things that don't look 100% perfect to me:
-) from the beginning to 23:00 i added one fist sized piece of beech wood every hour (3 times). this made the temperature go out of control it seems. the wood started to smoke, and after some time the temperature of the pit raised w/o air added (fan 0%).
-) at around 00:10 i added the pulled pork, that where the spikes come from, i guess this is ok
-) no idea what happened around 02:00??
-) at around 03:30 the fire went out. and this i don't understand. the coal ring was filled fully with briquettes. and the fire was started right in the middle.but still there is only one side burned down, and fresh coal on the other side which didn't get lit. no idea why, i thought the air burner would help here as well as it provides fresh air over the whole grate. i had to get up and relocate some coal.
-) same procedure as above today at 09:00.
would it be better to make a coal ring and let it burn down from one end to the other? (minion method)
edit: and another question: even if i set "fan min" to 20% it still goes out completely. why it that?
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Johannes S
TVWBB Member
and more pictures to post after the first "real" test. the meat was excellent. stopped at 92°C.
as i thought only parts of the briquettes were burnt. about a 1/4 was still unlit. the coalring was filled to full height. it now is not anymore, because it took some briquettes from the unlit side to feed the burning fire, so it actually looks as more coal is left than there actually is.
you can see the little holes where the air burner tried to push air through the ash. there was really a lot of ash, and it seems some holes where closed due to too much ash.
the red holes were open, the blue ones are mostly or completely closed and no working anymore. the three at the bottom which aren't seen on the photo were open as well.
this was what it looked like after removal of some ash. powering the fan made all holes blow fresh air.
i made a little video to demonstrate the air flow through all holes working
the questions remaining:
-) now that i saw the mass of ash produced i may move the air burner closer to the grill. this of course will make the chance of melting the solder higher.
-) would it be a better idea to make the holes on the lower side of the air burner so no ash can fall into the holes? or is the little air jet produced better to keep the fire burning.
-) any ideas why the coal did not burn through completely? is it to be expected to have this much coal left after the fire went out?
as i thought only parts of the briquettes were burnt. about a 1/4 was still unlit. the coalring was filled to full height. it now is not anymore, because it took some briquettes from the unlit side to feed the burning fire, so it actually looks as more coal is left than there actually is.
you can see the little holes where the air burner tried to push air through the ash. there was really a lot of ash, and it seems some holes where closed due to too much ash.
the red holes were open, the blue ones are mostly or completely closed and no working anymore. the three at the bottom which aren't seen on the photo were open as well.
this was what it looked like after removal of some ash. powering the fan made all holes blow fresh air.
i made a little video to demonstrate the air flow through all holes working
the questions remaining:
-) now that i saw the mass of ash produced i may move the air burner closer to the grill. this of course will make the chance of melting the solder higher.
-) would it be a better idea to make the holes on the lower side of the air burner so no ash can fall into the holes? or is the little air jet produced better to keep the fire burning.
-) any ideas why the coal did not burn through completely? is it to be expected to have this much coal left after the fire went out?
RalphTrimble
TVWBB Diamond Member
Hard to tell from your pic where the burner is, bit it should be up as close to the grate as possible, the higher the better for the ash issue obviously. I would definitely raise up that center section that you have aiming down to be parallel with the rest of the unit.
I don't use briquettes in my smokers/kamado, when I use them I generally start them in a chimney and get them all lit and white before cooking on them. I suggest you try real lump coal for your next cook. I think you will get a more complete burn and probably have less of an ash issue too.
I don't use briquettes in my smokers/kamado, when I use them I generally start them in a chimney and get them all lit and white before cooking on them. I suggest you try real lump coal for your next cook. I think you will get a more complete burn and probably have less of an ash issue too.