Lobster Sauce Question

[r benash]

OK - so I've made Lobster Profiteroles as a first course a couple times when I did the Christmas dinner as part of a surf and turf thing (Prime Rib main course).

Dinner is at my in-laws and I was asked to do that lobster first course. Of course I jumped in.

This is one occasion where you have an "excuse" to pick up a number of largish lobsters (2lb x 8 in this case). Reason is that when I make this everything basically gets used except the hard shells from the claws (but wait even they go into making the broth). Half of the shells get ground and are used as part of the sauce recipe.

Ran down to Philly picked up the lobsters came back and broke everything down. My beautiful partner was helping me clean up and slipped. She saw the little white bowl with the saved tomally and roe..... and tossed it

All is not lost, perhaps. I'm making a sauce using the recipe from Cooking. I need to sub the flavor essence added by the tomally and roe and looking for some help if there's someone that can offer an option.

My thought is that I will finish up the base recipe for the sauce then add fish sauce to taste.

Any other recommendations to add this last final flavor note at the end while the sauce is mounted would be appreciated.

It's a shame since you really need to be working from whole lobsters and a number of them to collect the tommaly and roe in enough quantity to make a difference, etc. I can fake it out and no one will notice but me. But just thought I would ask to see what others might think.

Otherwise thinking I will use the fish sauce to replicate that final note.

 

[Paul K]

Bummer,

Describe the sauce you were planning. The tomalley certainly adds a richness and unique flavor. The fish sauce idea can work, and definitely use the shells. Can you use eggs in your sauce? Some yolk might add richness.

Paul

 

[r benash]

It's the one in Cooking by James Petersen page 351.

You start with 6 lobsters

Grind lobster shells with chopped tomatoes

saute onion, celery, carrot.


Add the shell, tomato mixture

add tarragon, 1 cup cream, 2 cups broth and white wine - simmer

Work through a strainer

Return to pan and finish with the strained tomally/roe mixture. Heat without simmering.

 

[Marc]

Fish Sauce a good thing... but you will still be lacking the fatty goodness of the tomally/roe.
IMO It would be nice to bring that back to the party....What about a tiny bit of a semi-neutral oily fish like salmon or maybe salmon roe pureed? Need to bring back some of the fish fat.

 

[K Kruger]

I don't use the tomalley myself. For the roe you can use salmon or whitefish. Not something I'd worry about.

 

[r benash]

Paul/Kevin thanks. I think in the end it will be just fine without based on what I've found AFA stocks in the freezer.

I think the flavor can get close with fish sauce. But I have some fairly intense fish stock in the freezer that I use as a base for these black drum fish cakes I do.

Took that out, it has a nice little bit of fat on top. Actually a lot. As an update after thawing this looks to be a good source for fish fat/butter and has good flavor. Think I'll be using this as the replacement.

It's not critical as the tomally/roe is on the finish. But definitely thinking I need to work a little fat in as Marc mentions.

I think a have a reasonably good handle. I'll give it a shot and let you know what happened.

I do have the stock from the remaining shells that I'll cook down a little more than usual as well.

 

[K Kruger]

But definitely thinking I need to work a little fat in as Marc mentions.

Fish sauce isn't working for me here. I find it too - well, fishy - for a lobster sauce, which I prefer to be delicate. YMMV. As for the fat, I nearly always finish this type of sauce with beurre monté. Make it just after straining but before finishing the lobster base. (You can make the base in advance; make the butter emulsion not long before serving.) Then gently combine the base with a little beurre monté heating gently, working in as much of the butter as you wish. Warm without simmering. Serve.

[If you wish, after finishing the sauce, add your fish sauce a drop or two at a time, as seasoning.]

 

[Marc]

What Kevin said: but I still think the addition of a bit (very small) amount (fish sauce) will still make a good contribution to the overall flavor. A beurre monté, is great however on it's own it isn't (imo) gonna replicate the goodness and depth of the tomalley/roe without a bit of the fish sauce (or something!).
The fat from roe/tomalley is quite unique and a butter sauce on it's own ( to me) would be lacking.

 

[r benash]

Thanks. Will check out beurre monte. The nice thing from the stock out of the freezer is there's a nice lump of light fat on top that I might work in. The fish sauce is going to be held back and I'll just add a small amount as needed if I want to increase that note. I have this other option now. I'm thinking I'll sub some of this fish fat from the stock into the finish as the primary replacement.

Working on the sauce tonight to get it done ahead. Make the profiteroles late tomorrow. Use the sauce with the lobster filling. Hold some to the side for plating.

 

[r benash]

Ok, so yes I get Beurre Monte - that actually fits what I'm wanting to do. Make this sauce for use primarily for tossing the lobster in before loading into the profiteroles.

I would like to use some of the fish fat with the butter, seems like that's easy enough to do.

One question Beurre Mont needs to stay below 190 not to break. I've only done this previous right at the finish.

Should I stay with that or can I complete the whole sauce along with the mount? I.E. - can I mount the sauce and chill/reheat below 190 without problems or should I take the sauce and mount right be for serving onsite?

Sauce is actually done at this point except for the mount, just need to run it through a strainer and reserve at this point. Just wondering whether I should mount now or wait.

 

[K Kruger]

Beurre monté is not the same as monter au beurre. The latter refers to the process of mounting with butter, i.e., adding cold butter in small amounts, one at a time, to a warm sauce, and emulsifying as the butter with the sauce.

The former is butter that's emulsified with water. It's used in sauces and also to poach in. I like it for this application because I don't think the lobster base needs the more substantial thickening of the latter.

With either, care must be taken not to overheat.

With either, chilling is not a good idea. Finish the sauce just before service.

 

[r benash]

OK, so now my small mind is learning something

I have the sauce/reduction now all completed. I. E. Everything has been simmered together as above and forced through sieve/strainer then through linen to get rid of any trace of ground shell. The flavor is very nice.

So it is a liquid. Reheating then slowly whisking butter into this cup to 1.5 cups would be a monter au beurre process then?

I think I have that right now.

What I'm planning is that I will probably use some fish fat (it's pretty tasty and actually mild) along with the butter when I finish.

Thanks for the tip on not finishing then chilling!.

This will help me plan for Sunday. I'll take the liquid some butter and fish fat - mount then just toss the lobster in this sauce then load into the profiteroles.

I am probably going to use a tangerine glace during the plate as well. I really want this sauce to toss the lobster in rather than just using butter. The flavor at this point is very nice, no need for fish sauce, but I do miss the tomally/roe flavor previous.

Seems to me that in Petersons recipe the tomally/roe replaced the butter for a monter au beurre. I think I said all that right

Thanks for the education.

 

[K Kruger]

Yes, that would be the process and yes you said it right.

Google beurre monté and you'll see what it is and how to make. Very easy. If you go with this, make a cup or so and add a little fish fat during the process.

If you go with the butter mount add a little fat after you've emulsified a little butter into the sauce. Adjust as you continue adding butter.

The tangerine sounds nice.

The tomalley, as you probably know, functions as the lobster's liver/pancreas/intestines. It filters toxins. Unfortunately, those toxins remai in the tomalley. I quit using then when it was discovered that many contain stuff I would not want to serve my clients without disclosure - dioxin, in particular, among other things.

Just FYI.

 

[r benash]

Thanks again all.

Oh, yeah - spent a good bit doing the research last night

Kevin - yes your concern on the tomalley is noted. Similar in a way when making tiramisu and deciding whether I really want to do it with raw eggs or not.

This dialog has helped me understand the science a bit of adding the tomally/roe at the end and how best to replace it. It's function in the recipe beyond flavor only. In the end it won't be missed.

 

[r benash]

I thought it appropriate to get back on the final result. I often get calls on different topics usually troubleshooting on technology, etc.

I always hate it when the person doesn't get back with the final result.

So feel compelled to close the discussion.

So my lobster dish was a huge hit. Of course it was family but there were 18+ and some typically "don't like fish". There is some good competition as I married into a family that has 3 daughters and a son who are all excellent cooks. One is actually a gourmet and I love working with her as she spends a lot of time and effort, does research, etc.

The other sister and my wife are great cooks too and have some serious skills. We often collaborate and work together on recipes, technique, etc. for different events. A lot for family, a good number for friends and family and then for benefits, charity, etc. Else just helping each other with large cooks and organizing the kitchen during the "event".

It's a fun kitchen when we are working together.

The final dish changed a bit after the last post.

The dish I was planning changed from first course to appetizer.

All good, and my original plan fell in well along with the help I got here.

The sauce made from the ground shell stock was awesome and got mixed into the picked lobster, which ended up at about 4 pounds rounded.

I used the herbed choux batter to make "pancakes" rather than shells as there was no time for filling, etc. Big hit. They were semi soft in the center and the herb mix was excellent along with the lobster mix on top.

I changed up from making home made mayo as the recipe was a little heavy on truffle oil and EVOO.

Went with a theme that was a knotch up from typical lobster roll. Added truffle oil (just a touch), the shell stock that was reduced to about a cup and a half, some tarragon, some chopped chive, white/green pepper and salt to taste.

I ended up replacing the tomally/roe with some of the fish/stock fat that I mentioned upstream that was in the end milder and a much better end result. Tasting along the way and it didn't take much. Glad I had that stock on hand.

I really think that the fish sauce might have worked but would have gone over the edge pretty quickly and pushed the whole thing in another direction.

Loaded it on the pancakes for the appetizer, then drizzled some tangerine gastrique around the platters and tossed some fresh herb.

I ended up working four large platters of this "lobster tapenade" that went quickly and was very popular. Some folks walked up to me and said it was the best they ever had (lobster).

What's funny is the "left over". We brought back the lobster meat that was left.

My wife/partner - I hate the term "wife" was adamant not to change anything when I made lobster rolls. I wanted to push the leftover more toward a typical lobster roll recipe.

I had to make hers different. But the push I did towards typical lobster roll was awesome IMHO. I just touched with a little more mayo, some finely minced celery to taste and some dill. Wow. I Had just been at Samson Street Oyster house in Philly a few days before and I think I got pretty close.

Of course used soft rolls that were butter coated and grilled, but couldn't get enough.

Makes me want to do straight up lobster rolls now. I think I have it figured out.

My critique is that I had all of the lobster cooked right before I picked it up. Given the time I would do it myself and pull parts as Jeff Beisinger did in his recent post and keep the tail meat down to 140 deg.

Next time will be better - and it will probably be lobster rolls

Thanks for all of your help and head banging!!!