I don't get it...


 
D

Darrell J.

TVWBB Fan
Over the past couple of months, I visited a couple of restaurants that are supposed to be restaurants of a couple of pitmasters. One, in particular, was opened up by one of the participants in BBQ Pitmaster's. The name will remain annonymous. I'll sum it up by saying, "boiled ribs".

I just don't get it. I've heard the arguments before about making mass quantities, yada yada. It doesn't add up to me. If you are world famous, why would you want to stamp your name on such an inferior product? I know the general public wants fall off the bone ribs, even though my tastes are a little more refined. I get that. No complaints here. However, when you boil off all of your rub and then drown it in bbq sauce you are creating and perpetuating a myth that as long as you have decent sauce and fall of the bone ribs you are awesome. In this past instance, even decent sauce might be a bit of a stretch.

I honestly could have gotten much better bbq at Famous Daves or some of the other well-known restaurants. Not to mention, I could have cooked it myself. When you're on the road though you want to try stuff out there to get ideas, etc. If I only had the resources and time to opening up my own joint. This area sorely needs good bbq. To the backyard I go.
icon_smile.gif
 
Same here...........I haven't eatin' any BBQ around me that I have been crazy about. Someone once recommended a place and raved about the brisket. So I couldn't wait to try it. What disappointment, gray like it came out of the oven, tasteless and tough as leather. My first attempt at a brisket was better than that sheeeesh.
 
That's exactly what I experienced this weekend. Gray, life-less and obviously par-boiled ribs. It should have been called "boiled-b-que".
 
It is really hard to make a living off of BBQ is what I am learning from visiting many places.

Most recently in North Carolina and VA.

Holding the product after a volume cook is one challenge. I noticed this in visits to central PA Q joints as well.

You really need volume of foot traffic and have to balance that with a holding method.

But if you are boiling from the start, that's a fast road to ruin unless the public doesn't really care. If they don't and you need to feed your family - you will make the trade offs IMHO.

It's inevitable. Restaurants in general are a tough business. Pick a niche like good Q and trying to make a living from it is a tough choice.

That's why I believe you most likely won't find a Q joint that meets your standards if you are an accomplished "backyard pit master".

A good analogy would be living with 1st and 2nd generation Italians that are great cooks themselves. Most likely over time they won't visit Italian restaurants. Because they know they will be disappointed. Unless they go to high end. They have the flavor notes ingrained and they also know quality. They are always going to be measuring to that delta.

Same with Q. Once you know how to control fire, smoke, "done" and flavor notes. You are spoiled.

Any place that has to do volume will most likely disappoint. You probably need to adjust your expectations.....
 
Actually, it's not hard to hold barbecue. It just takes the right equipment. Some places have it - but it doesn't help.

After over two decades of near constant traveling, and many hundreds of visits to many hundreds of Q joints (without ever being very impressed), I only bother going, these days, on rare occasion, for the ambiance - in the places that have that - not the food.
 
Ray,

I absolutely agree with what you're saying. It just shocked me that this restaurant was worse than many famous chain restaurants that produce ribs. This person was on the TLC BBQ Pitmaster series. Applebees would have even put this to shame and they mass produce too. Just a little tongue shocked, I guess.

Thanks for the insight.
 
The bottom line is MONEY !! There trading on a REP to haul in all the $$$$$$ they can and quality be @#$%^&* . IF anyone wanted to they could make and sale good Q IMO . It just easier to toss bad Q out the door for the $$.

Just because someone is or was on TV don't makem pitt masters !
 
Place like that a couple towns over in westchester. They rave about it in a local mag so I had to go try it. WORST brisket I have ever had. Not only was it grey but it was sliced like you get sliced cold cuts at the deli...so thin you can see through it and it was soaking in juices (was more like soup) to try to hide how thin and aweful it was. Bunch of my friends went with me and got pulled pork, ribs and what not...terrible! Ribs were def boiled and the pulled pork was done in a slow cooker over cooked and SO DRY! Again swiming in sauce to try to hide it. Safe to say we have never gone back.

I'm with you Darrell. If I had the time and the resources I'd open up my own joint. While I'm no pit master, people would be shocked at the difference between the two of us. Just going from paper thin brisket to nice thick juicy slices would get the WOW face. Oh well...
 
I never expect much when I go to a BBQ joint. The ambiance is the main thing to enjoy. I especially DO NOT readily criticize BBQ joints that were around before the modern competition style places. As long as they don't serve yesterdays food.... I'm willing to give it a few tries. If you hate BBQ sauce, you might as well not waste your time going out to eat BBQ. That is going to be the main difference between places.

Personally, I love trying BBQ places. It is the one type of food I don't judge when I eat it. I just smile, make a mess, and enjoy the whole deal.

I am upset when a new place brags about winning awards and serves up lousy Q. Hole-in-the-walls get more forgiveness.
 
Yes, exactly...money. They want to capitalize on their name. And it works. They get paid. Do they ruin their rep? Maybe. But they probably don't ruin their rep in the competition scene b/c everyone knows they did the restaurant just for money and that the food there is not the same as the comp food. And they don't ruin their name in the restaurant industry b/c the ribs/bbq at most restaurants is garbage.

I actually kinda liked Famous Daves ribs. Pretty tasty. Waaaaaaaaaaaaay better than the Phils' bbq we have in San Diego that everyone is crazy over for some reason.

If you want super legit bbq, you probably have to cook it yourself, or find someone who's cooking on a small scale where they can give it personal attention.

Was it the restaurant they visited in the show?
 
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tim L.:
Yes, exactly...money. They want to capitalize on their name. And it works. They get paid. Do they ruin their rep? Maybe. But they probably don't ruin their rep in the competition scene b/c everyone knows they did the restaurant just for money and that the food there is not the same as the comp food. And they don't ruin their name in the restaurant industry b/c the ribs/bbq at most restaurants is garbage.

I actually kinda liked Famous Daves ribs. Pretty tasty. Waaaaaaaaaaaaay better than the Phils' bbq we have in San Diego that everyone is crazy over for some reason.

If you want super legit bbq, you probably have to cook it yourself, or find someone who's cooking on a small scale where they can give it personal attention.

Was it the restaurant they visited in the show? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

No, it wasn't the same place. Lots of awards on the shelves etc. but the quality was very poor. My wife felt like she was drinking her pork shoulder. Gray, lifeless, no taste, and very wet.

Although money may be an issue, it's going to become a bit of a snakebite in the end. I was there on a Saturday night with live music on tap, and there were probably only two other tables with folks eating. Even for poor, processed, boiled bbq this place obviously ranks pretty low amongst the locals.

I believe my expectations were to eat something at least on par with some of the regulars (Famous Daves, Smoky Bones, etc). It just got to me that it was no where near as good as any other place that I've had in my life. Oh well, you live and learn. As I said before, to the backyard I go.
icon_smile.gif
 
I agree.......most restaurants that advertise authentic Q usually don't measure up to my feeble attempts at home.

If you're in MD, try Andy Nelson's in Cockeysville/Hunt Valley. I've had some great luck there; I really like their PP and sauces.

I like their potato salad as well.....a little spicy.
 
That's why, when we have family/friends visit, I let them eat at their desired "Famous Memphis (FILL IN THE BLANK)" first before smoking something at home.

I think we in Memphis are pretty blessed with good que joints, but it's still not as good as the results you'll get at home with a WSM and a little practice.

Plate of ribs at the Bar-B-Que Shop is still **** good though.
icon_cool.gif
 
We (like most) have RibFest featuring local and international award winning teams (Jack & Royal winners) 5 minutes from my house every year. Every year I get the ribs, pulled pork and chicken combo with a side order of brisket. Every year I like my PP better overall, my ribs better for smoke and texture and the chicken is a wash depending on sauce. Also every year I like their brisket better and their rib sauce much better. That said, I think my mother in law's oven broiled honey garlic ribs are some of the best I've ever tasted. My point is, you like what YOU like.

JDH
 
James, I wish I'd have known about a Q festival in Toronto when I lived up there for about 20 years (I moved to the U.S. in 2000). I'm up in Northern NJ and finding good Q here is almost impossible.

I'm with the other posters here, too (and in fact I had a short thread on the topic a few weeks back on this forum). I've never had barbecue from a restaurant that beats my own.

I was in Dayton, OH about 2 months ago and the joint that got raves from all the locals was nothing but sauce-slathered pigslop. Fall off the bone (in a very bad way) and not very flavorful. I had a similar experience in a NYC Q restaurant (Brother Jimmy's, near Madison Square Garden) a couple of weeks ago.

When I lived in Toronto I loved Red Devil (Queensway and the West Mall), but they only lasted about 2 years then went pointy-ends up, IIRC. Another one that's pretty decent is the Corner Stable in the Timonium/Hunt Valley part of MD, but their racks are far too small (about a pound or less) and horribly over-priced for what you get.

I'd love to have regular access to competition-grade Q and have a chance at eating barbecue that's better than what I can crank out on my WSM. My first brisky will be happening this coming weekend, and although I'm sure it will be tasty, I have no benchmarks against which to compare it!
 
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">I'd love to have regular access to competition-grade Q and have a chance at eating barbecue that's better than what I can crank out on my WSM. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Ain't gonna happen. Comp Q is not sold in Q joints. And you can turn out better Q than comp Q at home. You're probably already doing it. Comp Q is all about a very narrow style, the fun and camaraderie of comps, etc., not the be-all, end-all results (despite what you may hear or read) because it is neither. It is about getting judges to grade you well based on appearance and one bite. To that end, most comp Q is over-the-top, and not necessarily in a good way.
 
I've resigned myself to the fact that Q joints will never have the "good stuff," but I think the only access I'll have to Q that's better than my own is at the June BBQ festival in NYC. I don't think there's anything similar in my part of the world. And at $8 for a tiny serving, I dunno how much I could afford to sample.

Lemme put it another way. I'm pretty good at doing up steaks. Really good, in fact, but the reality is I can't come close to places like Peter Luger's and Keens Chophouse in NYC. Something about access to dry-aged prime and 1800 degree salamanders/ovens. They set the standard that I try to match. Legendary pitmasters with cases of trophies likewise set the standard of what the best in barbecue is, but unfortunately, there's no way (short of road trips) to experience it. I may make amazing ribs, but without anything to compare them to, how can I be sure? Will my first brisket this weekend really be good or just "meh--it's edible"?
 
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Legendary pitmasters with cases of trophies likewise set the standard of what the best in barbecue is, </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I disagree. They set the standard of what the best in comp Q might be - something you may or may not like, actually. (I like comps and comp people - and have and continue to help many individuals and teams. I find the Q inedible, mostly - though if I can nab some before the sauce goes on, and if it's free of an over-the-top amount of MSG, and if it has not been injected with FAB or some ungodly sweet injection, then I like it.)

Comp Q is meant to impress judges in one bite. In many cases (most, probably, but not all), it is not something one wants to eat more of. It often needs to be toned down significantly for that.
 
Peter, if you want to sample Competition Q then consider being a KCBS judge. You'll have all the access til your heart and belly are content.
icon_biggrin.gif
 
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by paul h:
Peter, if you want to sample Competition Q then consider being a KCBS judge. You'll have all the access til your heart and belly are content.
icon_biggrin.gif
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'd love to...if there were any KCBS-sanctioned events near me! My wife and I are pretty well stuck in the North Jersey area due to on-call work requirements. Even getting into Manhattan is a stretch some days. If there were comps nearby, I'd have either been lined up to judge a long time ago or I'd have been cooking in them!

But to go back to the thread, the only real option around here are NYC-based Q-joints, which cater to NYC's "upscale" tastes and are at NYC prices. Two beers, 4 bones and a side worked out to $45, and it was awful.

Kevin, you bring up an interesting connundrum, and I'm interested in how others view it. If comp Q is that over-the-top and artificial ("not something one wants to eat more of") and restaurant Q is more often than not a saucy slab of poorly prepared pork products, then where is the "benchmark" barbecue to be had? Where are the real "standards" to be had?

We can ooh and ahh at the scrumptous pics on TVWBB (and I do, oh, I do--y'all make some awesome lookin' food here folks). However, where does one find ribs, brisket, pulled pork and chicken done in a way that serious barbecue fans would say " that is the best slab-o-Q I've ever et?"
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

 

Back
Top