High Heat Temp Control


 
Alan F

Alan F

TVWBB Pro
I did a brisket smoke yesterday at 325 using a 12" clay saucer in an 18". It was a little windy and it took a long time to dial in the temps and when they were, there were 10 - 15 degree swings. Very different behavior than a smoke at 225.

Are there any tricks for running a high heat smoke?
 
Ditch the saucer, just run the pan empty with several layers of foil over the top. This method can be done for low or high temps. The saucer causes slooooooooooooooooow reactions to vent adjustments and adds no heat sink properties, it releases every bit of heat it recieves from below.
 
You got me, I mis read your comments. Seriously if you think they are instant with the saucer try it without!

However it sounds like fuel lighting and then calming, over and over. The wind magnified that as well.
 
As in how I run and empty pan, start with 8-12 lit as I like to come up slow for smoke and smoke ring formation. If I wanted 250-275 I shut the bottoms to where I know my cooker(s) run at that temp usually at 180-200. The temp will come soon enough once the meat heats up, too many folks overshoot or hurry the meat and cooker to a point where you will have way too many lit coals.

You can get it stable by doing this sneaky approach. For anything higher than 275 I'm not concerned as I just would open all vents 100%.

I actually use water now for anything less than 275 and do my HH cooks on Kettles. Don't care for the burning and acrid smells/flavors from the fat dripping on a hot foil pan.
 
It's been said before: the meat doesn't care (about 10-15 degree temp swings). If you want any better stability, I'd throw in the oven after foiling or check into the different ATC's...a few really cheap.

I'm with Glenn W. though. Not convinced you weren't oversteering due to the clay pot base and HH to me just makes more sense on a kettle.
Still though, I'm not worried about small temp swings. I don't want to overcook, and other than that, just want to get it done on time to stay out of hot water with the wife.
 
Dave, my biggest concern was going over 350 and having the rub burn.

Can you tell me about how you dial in HH temps? Besides the empty pan, how stable do you get the temps?
 
Alan, first off, hard for me to relate to problems with temps that high, but I'd for sure ditch the clay. I'd only use clay for bad weather to help HOLD temps.

If your wsm has decent sectional and door fit, you should be able to easily keep temps under 350* by simply closing the door crack some more. Foil early and you shouldn't have any issues. Wait too long though, and not only will your bark get too hard in places, but you'll pick up that burning grease smell from the pan Glenn was mentioning. Why not just shut the door and cook at more of a moderate temp like 275-300* though?
 
This is the exact issue I have been to ask about. I wanted to a few turkey breasts at HH - something around 325 to 350, in order to get the skin nicely done.

But my 18.5" always has run cool, and I couldn't get the temp over around 300 even with all the vents at 100%. I was using a clay saucer.

So if I want to hit and hold at 325 lose the saucer? Anything else?

One other thing - I have a problem finding large briskets, and when I do small ones (say 3#) they come out tough, tasty, nice and smokey, but a bit tough. Any advice.
 
Originally posted by J Digg:
This is the exact issue I have been to ask about. I wanted to a few turkey breasts at HH - something around 325 to 350, in order to get the skin nicely done.

But my 18.5" always has run cool, and I couldn't get the temp over around 300 even with all the vents at 100%. I was using a clay saucer.

So if I want to hit and hold at 325 lose the saucer? Anything else?

One other thing - I have a problem finding large briskets, and when I do small ones (say 3#) they come out tough, tasty, nice and smokey, but a bit tough. Any advice.
Click to expand...

J, what does the skin matter if cooking turkey breast? You can grill 'em indirect on the kettle as fast as you want, but a buddy sent me a pic the other day of the juiciest looking turkey breast ever to appear on my monitor screen. Nice smoke ring, to. I don't remember if he brined or salted, but I do know that he targeted 250* with water in the pan.

Keep looking as far as the briskets go. I'll never cook a small brisket again, especially small partial flats. Foil is your friend though if you have to, and in that case I'd open the vents and plan to cook around 300*. No advantage really to cook any faster, but why not just use the kettle if you want to?
 
Hi Alan.
IIRC you had a post on who had the hottest running WSM or something like that awhile back.
Was that run with a saucer?
If your WSM runs hot (like mine) than ditch the saucer like Glen mentioned and catch your temps on the way up.
IMO the saucer and wind caused your temp swings albeit not that big of deal depending on the upside as you mentioned.
A wind break does wonders on low -slows as it prevents spikes and heat loss, but also on a HH it helps on preventing any temp swings as any breeze will stoke an already hot fire.
I do HH all the time on my WSM, and I don't have any issues on any burning or greasy smells using an empty foiled pan with a proper air-space. But you can always add a disposable foil pan to the lower grate to catch any drippings and avoid that.

Tim
 
Hi Tim, thanks for the reply.

Looking back on that hottest wsm thread I'm wondering if part of the problem was user error. I never would shut down two vents and run with one. The first time that was done was a 225 smoke with a new clay saucer, and I was slightly stunned how stable the temp became.

My issue now isn't a hot running wsm or not being able to get temps high enough. Ideally I'd like to set and forget one on a 325 cook.

I posted this thread because I hoped to learn if others had a trick to high stable temps. I've only done one cook so I'm certain things will improve with experience.

I could hold 325 but it was very touchy. For instance, that day 325 was held with one vent completely open and another vent somewhere between 50-75% open. And the slightest touch to the 50-75% vent would have a 25 degree change in temperature. Changes were instantaneous.

So I am wondering if this is what others experience at high temps and/or what they do about it.

Also, I don't understand the reasoning behind running an empty pan at these temps. With the saucer it was hard. Without it I imagine it would be next to impossible. Note: do to inexperience I was trying to dial in that 325 temp for two hours. The saucer was up to temp while I finally got it set somewhat.
 
Yea, what I've read over the few yrs on the board is how some WSM's run different than others.

Mine has always settled in quite nicely @275-300.Usually can get 4-5hrs of a steady temp using a thermo stuck in the top vent @ 300-315.

I haven't used my saucer for a while, but I foiled it in the pan in response to another post. Forgot about it for a few days, then decided to fire up my WSM for a HH butt. I did my normal routine and started closing down all 3 vents 3/4 closed when thermo read 275, settled in @ 300 and I was off to do other stuff.
I knew somethin was wrong about 2hrs later when I heard the fat drippings bubbling away. Thermo read 350 and I shut down all three vents to zero,took awhile to get back down to 300 but I was chasin temps for the rest of that cook. I just chalked that one up to cooking outside in the elements, until the next day when cleaning the pan I uncovered the saucer.
Try one with an empty foiled pan, catch your temps about 20-25 deg shy of your target and see how that works.
Good luck!

Tim
 
When my unit runs cooler than I want with all my vents open I just put a small stick under the lid to let more air in . Works for me.Some guys even prop open the access door. If you 're cooking at or over 300 so what. It may take a little longer but no sweat just enjoy the cook and try to learn something for the next cook
 
Tim, in your example, what problem did the saucer cause? Made it hard to adjust temps after it got too hot?

What has your experience been with an empty pan?
 
Yes, it did make it harder to get the temps back down and once there any breeze would cause the temps to swing back up. My vents are a little mangled, bent away from the bowl so a simple wind break kind of helped.
That and the extra mass in the pan caused the drippings to burn,bubble away. Cant say I ever noticed it that bad running my WSM @ 350 with a foiled pan with an air-space.
With an empty pan mine has always had a sweet spot between 275-300 with minimum fuss. If I want 325-350 some-days I can just open the vents 100% or I might have to crack the lid or prop the door like Paul mentioned.

Tim
 
Originally posted by timothy:
...and the extra mass in the pan caused the drippings to burn,bubble away. Cant say I ever noticed it that bad running my WSM @ 350 with a foiled pan with an air-space....Tim
Click to expand...

I can see that, and maybe that explains why some guys have no problem with the grease running over with just the big saucer in place of the pan. Lots of folks like the fat in the fire flavor, so maybe the burnt grease flavor isn't much different?
 
Just to be clear..My pan didn't run over. Its a 12" saucer set down a few inches in the 14" pan.
Pic of saucer and pan.
Foiled.

My problem was that once the saucer heated up and let go of the heat at whatever temp, it caused the foil to overheat and burn,boil away the drippings.
It's not normally what I get at those temps using a foiled empty pan, unless I use a baste,glaze or rub that has decnt amount of sugar or fruit.

Tim
 
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