Cryovac: Pros & Cons


 
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Rita Y

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/infopop/emoticons/icon_confused.gif I've seen references to CRYOVAC in many posts in the archives. With your help, I thought I'd begin a new thread to compile all the pros and cons about it.

I've seen cryovac baby backs at Costco (Swift label) that have absolutely NO INFORMATION about additives/brines in the package, but there IS a liquid in there. I've read posts that mention a "ham-like flavor"......

I know most of you have experience with cryovaced meats (ribs, brisket, pork butt...???). Won't you please contribute your information, thoughts, biases, etc.?

Thanks, y'all, for your thoughts!
Rita
 
See this thread:

Mega Salty BRITU

To summarize, any fresh meat that is injected with solution must be labeled as such under USDA rules. The liquid you see in the Costco Swift Brand Cryovac ribs is not a flavor enhancing solution, just meat juices.

You will get a ham-like flavor from fresh pork butt or ribs that are tumbled or injected with solution to add flavor and moisture.

Regards,
Chris
 
That's great information, Chris, and I thank you.

I thought I'd read that wholesale-level nutritional labeling was not as detailed as consumer-level labeling. Hopefully I'm wrong about that.
Rita
 
I think the "ham-like flavor" with ribs has to do with smoke exposure. What we would call a "ring" on brisket sometimes turns rib meat completely pink. My experience with briskets in mass-market supermarkets are that they are all cryovaced. Sometimes they trim them in the store, but they all come in the store the same way. If you want a non-cryovaced brisket you need to find a real butcher.
 
Based on the baby-backs I bought this week and everything else in the meat counter, all Armour brand pork products now are labeled that they are packed in a brine solution up to 10% of gross weight.

It's basically a ham brine minus the spices: water, salt, sodium nitrite, etc.
 
I believe that it is going to get harder to find pork that is not solution added. The only thing I'm finding now is Fletchers out of Canada.
My understanding is that now that Tyson has bought IBP you will be seeing beef solution add also.
I believe we are going to have revise the rubs, injection, mops, and possibly cooking techniques we use to compensate for this. I don't believe enough of the general public will care enough to get the packers to change this practice.

Bying directly from the framers and ranchers will be an option for some but not everyone.
Jim
 
When all else fails, go to the mom and pop meat shops, butchers, meat packing houses etc. Around here, those are the only places where you can buy meat that is guaranteed to be free of these brining solutions. Make sure you ask them first. The good meat shops pride themselves in not selling that kind of meat. They will always stick to the traditional, non-altered meats.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jim Minion:
[qb]I believe we are going to have revise the rubs, injection, mops, and possibly cooking techniques we use to compensate for this. [/qb] <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yep. Basically, these meats have already been injected and brined for you.

I agree that the practice will continue. The brines that are used generally contain sodium nitrite which is going to act like a curing agent and extend the shelf life of these packaged meats. Combine that with the obvious benefits to the seller of charging $5.99 a pound for water and I don't see the practice ending any time soon.
 
/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif That's pretty disheatening news! Here I am in a city of at least 2 million and there's only one real butcher less than an hour's drive from home, and I hear he's pretty pricey. When I'm in his neighborhood, I'll make it a point to check him out.

Costco only had cryovac Swift brand back ribs last time I was there. No labeling at all except for "Swift," and as I mentioned, there was liquid in the bag, so I'm suspicious.

There are 2 farmers' markets here that have good meat, but both involve a half-day's excursion, although the end result would be worth it.

Thanks for all the input, everyone.
Rita
 
The meat packer I go to is located in a more grungy part of town where the building lease price is cheaper I guess. But, his prices are always better than most supermarkets. He always has Pork Butts for $1.19 lb and you get 2 to a package. They are usually good size around 8-9 lbs each.
He has Brisket for $1.59 lb which is kind of expensive, but that is for the "Choice" grade, not the select grade like Wal-Mart sells for $0.98 lb.
And, if you buy by the case, the price goes down naturally. They get the best Spareribs I have ever seen.
Check your phone book for some butcher shops or meat packaging houses in the poorer parts of town or the "less desirable" neighborhoods. This may sound racial, or biased or whatever, but it has always been true. You find the best meat deals in the neighborhoods where people can't afford expensive meat. I have found some excellent BBQ shacks and stands in these areas as well. Some of the best Q I have ever had.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Rita Y:
[qb]Costco only had cryovac Swift brand back ribs last time I was there. No labeling at all except for "Swift," and as I mentioned, there was liquid in the bag, so I'm suspicious.[/qb] <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Rita: I can't swear to it, but I think that federal law now requires labeling meats when they are packed in a brine. My guess is that is why every package of Armour pork in my grocery store is labeled in fairly print type on the package.

The presence of liquid in the pack isn't going to be a reliable indicator as all packaged meat is going to render some liquid. The brined ribs I bought the other day had a decidedly "slimy" feel to them that didn't wash off. The ribs were still unbelievably good, so I wouldn't lose much sleep over a little brine.

We buy much of our meat from a local meat market. They don't have a great selection, but their stuff is always good and no more expensive than the grocery store. But, we still buy quite a bit from the grocery store because it's 1 mile away rather than a 7 mile special trip.
 
How dumb I am. Last week I did a 7 pound pork butt on my WSM. Did it to a temperature of 200 degrees. NOW remember I am a beginner. Was surprised at how small the pile of scrap was when it was pulled. Was even more surprised when I weighed the pulled meat---2lbs.5oz. It had a ham taste and I told my wife the only answer was that it was salt water injected like a ham.

Then I find this post and find out that I have to read the fine print on the label. But the liquid in the bottom of the cryovac package should have tipped me off. Wish I would have read these threads first. They won't catch me again!!! $1.69 a pound for water. Albertsons.

This is normal for me. If I had all the money I have spent like this for knowledge I would be rich, but dumb. Read the fine print.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Chris Allingham:
To summarize, any fresh meat that is injected with solution must be labeled as such under USDA rules. The liquid you see in the Costco Swift Brand Cryovac ribs is not a flavor enhancing solution, just meat juices.

Regards,
Chris <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Chris is absolutely correct. Everything added must be printed on the label.

How do I know this...?

My (much) better-half has worked in the meat industry half her life, mostly as a meat buyer for one of the bigger companys frequently mentioned on this board.(yes, I tell her about all the raves & the occasional complaint too)

I know they 'pump' certain seafoods. Some companys also 'pump' certain cuts of pork. ('pump' is an industry term, to 'pump' is to force water and/or solution into a product under pressure.)
One example is Armour "Guaranteed Tender" Pork .

By law the label on all *pumped pork product (try saying *that 3 times fast!) will read something like "Enhanced with up to 10% of a soultion containing water, salt and sodium phospate" and seafood will say "water added".

Imagine paying 3 or $4 a pound for salty water! (& up to $9 a pound for 'pumped' scallops!)

As for cry-o-vac, Ive also been lectured on this, as she is tired of me asking the same question every time I opened a cry-o-vac pack!

I use to question the weird smell when you first cut open the package, she said it was the nitrogen that caused the weird smell,& that it would 'go away' in a few minutes.
It does.

As for the actual cry-o-vac process, she informs me that the air is removed from the package & replaced w/nitrogen, then the package is vacuum-sealed, all this for greater shelf-life, color retention, etc.

Anyway, thats the best of my recollection on this subject, if I've missed anything, I'll grill her tonight about this topic, & will post the meat of her answer.
 
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