Brisket Quandary


 
Mike P.

Mike P.

TVWBB All-Star
I've just had 1st successful smoke(a Boston Butt) on the Mighty 18.5" WSM right out of the box. Ready to tackle a brisket.

So far after much research here and other places, I've decided to go low and slow, power through the stall with no foil, cook on the top rack, use water in the pan, never raise the lid, no mop,225*-235* cook temp,use hickory chunks for smoke, not care how long it takes,use a premium packer's cut, and pray.

The rest is still up in the air. I've learned there are hundreds of ways to do brisket on a WSM. Sooo... I have a few questions for the Pros here:

1. Does anyone know where I can find info on the anatomy of a packer's cut? I know point and flat terms but still cannot recognize them by looking.
2. Given the smoking conditions to be used, Should fat cap be left on or should I trim it?
3. I'm also seeing hundreds of dry rub recipes. I've used kosher salt and ground peppercorns which make a good bark. Does cumin, garlic flakes, paprika, etc. really improve the taste of the brisket much?
4. How many folks use yellow mustard? I'm having difficulty with this concept too.
5. Fat side up or down? I've read down keeps the meat more insulted from the drying effect of the heat and if it's smoked fat side up, the juices do not render into the meat but roll off into the water pan.

Thanks for reading this long winded post. Just trying to get it right on the 1st try. Any and all input appreciated.
 
You're on the right track, but the narrowest temp range I'd consider would be 235-250* once getting up to temp using the Minion method. Don't see any point in cooking any slower than that, and if you were using another kind of smoker and the brisket wasn't directly over a water pan I might say to try smoking a little faster, even without foiling.

For example, on my old UDS I smoked many a brisket in well less than 1hr/lb. in the 250-275* range (without foiling) with fantastic results. The type of smoker, how it cooks and what temp it likes has a lot of bearing on things. Don't buy the talk about having to stay down "around 225*". The meat doesn't care, as some folks say.

As to your other concerns, there's a lot of info on the informative part of the site, and I'd suggest getting a choice packer around 12 lbs. If there's several to choose from, look for one that's thicker down on the flat end. Cook til it's tender enough to easily stick a probe in the thickest part of the flat, and then wrap in foil and keep hot in a cooler with some other insulation for a couple of hours or more.

http://www.virtualweberbullet.com/brisketselect.html
 
Dave, Thanks for the Excellent reply and link. I just thought that I had read all the great info on this site. I am going back to school and reading the info on the link you supplied.

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I much more prefer brisket cooked at high heat (both in terms of results and process) but try low/slow and see what you think.

I'll echo Dave and add:

1. A packer should be labeled as such, often 'Brisket, whole, packer cut' or the like. In some stores that carry them they are not displayed. You have to ask at the counter for a whole brisket. Do not buy anything from any 'butcher' who proffers a different cut saying it is 'like brisket'. It isn't.

2. Trim or not. I don't bother trimming the fatcap - don't really see the point. I sometimes trim out some of the large knob of fat between the point and flat (it's obvious), but one can easily remove the sliver of fat when one slices and serves, if serving to the fat-averse. No fuss, no muss.

3. Paprika, no, but other spices and herbs, yes, imo. There are those that swear by 'salt-and-pepper-only' but I am not one of them. To me the results are lackluster: dog food. YMMV but try a well constructed rub (imo, if it has paprika and/or dry mustard in it, it is not well constructed) at least once and see what you think.

4. Don't bother. It offers nothing in the way of flavor and is rather a PITA. It does not 'tenderize' the meat, as some claim. It can serve to help the rub stick - but the rub will stick fine without it.

5. Down. It protects the meat from the more direct heat emanating from below, one, and two, fat up means you're scraping a lot of rub off the lean side of the meat when it goes on the grate and is lifted off. The fat does not soak into the meat or anything even close to that. Fat down.
 
I like your plan of no foil while on the WSM. I recently abandoned foil on low/slow brisket cooks and am much happier with the end result.

I don't trim the fat cap. I go with fat cap down, water in the pan.

I have never used mustard on a brisket, just seemed wrong for some reason. You can get a nice bark without it. I recently did a brisket with hickory smoke only because I had run out of mesquite. I was disappointed. Brisket just ain't brisket without mesquite smoke, but that's just me...

Good luck with your first brisket!
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2. i was under the impression that you should trim the fat cap because the rub won't penetrate it.

4. i like brushing my meat with some vegetable oil before i apply the rub, not mustard. i dont get the point either. mustard is water based.

but i just want to echo what the poster above me here said. i dont know about hickory for beef. i prefer straight oak or a combo of oak and mesquite. hickory and/or fruit woods are just too sweet IMO for cow flesh.
 
{depending on the mustard, it's vinegar based which is why it's used as a base.)

If the packer it trimmed, you should have a fat cap about 1/4-3/8 thick.

When I buy mind, I have them trim it because it's easier for them to toss that 1-2 lbs of fat into their barrel than me beat the dogs away from the trash later.
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I like to do fat cap up just for whatever flavor I might get. If you're using water in the pan, the bottom is fine. If not, it may or may not get too much heat or dry out. I've done both and didn't have any issue.

I actually scored the fat cap to get some rub in, but I'm not sure it did much, but the brisket comes out great.

Rub's are personal. I just came up with another for beef that I really like. Ones I make for pork are very different. Salt and pepper are key, then tweak from there. Either way, if you cook the brisket right, it may not even matter, it should have tons of flavor.
 
My two cents. 1 trim or untrimmed there is enough marbling throughout that it makes little difference. 2 fat cap up or down makes little difference because its not over coals. Its in an oven so to speak. the heat is around it, not over or under it. 3 I like mustard. Its water based so won't add messy pan plus vinegar breaks down meat slightly adding to tenderness. Flavor is not boosted by it, just aides in adhering more of the rub. 4 I have stopped using water in the pan because it slows down the cook(resulting in more time and more charcoal consumption) and isn't really needed IMO. Its already a cut meant for low and slow like most bbq. Doesn't need any more moisture. 5 I feel like the most under rated seasonings in rubs are the "earth" type. Thyme, celery seed, thyme, celery seed, and oregano. Did I mention thyme and celery seed? Oregano is good too.
 
1. Chris has a VERY excellent video right here on this site about trimming brisket. Check the cooking topics area.

2. I trim off the really hard fat. It won't render anyway. I do leave a thin layer of soft fat on as it will render. Run your hand over the meat and you will feel the difference. You won't feel the soft fat, it's softer than the meat.

3. I'm with Kevin. The only thing Paprika does is add color. The rest is to your liking. If you're really not sure then Plowboy's Bovine Gold is a good place to start. If you don't want to order online then go to your local grocery store and McCormick makes a couple of rubs that are decent in a pinch.

4. I tried it a few times and all it did was make a HUGE mess in the cooker. If your having trouble getting the rub to stick, spritz it down with water, juice, broth, beer, etc. before rubbing.

5. Down. Why would you want the fat juice to run down the side of the meat and wash off the rub you worked so hard to put on? It's not going to go INTO the meat. Any drying effect will be the same all the way around.

Russ
 
So far after much research here and other places, I've decided to go low and slow, power through the stall with no foil, cook on the top rack, use water in the pan, never raise the lid, no mop,225*-235* cook temp,use hickory chunks for smoke, not care how long it takes,use a premium packer's cut, and pray.
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You covered quite a bit above. As for the next questions, it's really a dealers choice on all of them. For me:

1) Google for meat cuts. Chris' video here for prep.
2) I trim a little between the point and flat and remove the gross, pink, slippery fat on top of the flat (the point side).
3) S&P may be the norm in Texas but a rub with more depth results in a more flavouful bark. Lots of recipes in the Recipes section here.
4) I don't use mustard/oil/etc... I find the rub sticks just fine without.
5) Fat side down for me. Insulation as the fire facing side will still get more direct heat than the opposite.

Just my thoughts.
 
Originally posted by John Thom:
My two cents. 1 trim or untrimmed there is enough marbling throughout that it makes little difference.
<span class="ev_code_RED">I'd say it depended on which fat you trimmed and how much.</span>

2 fat cap up or down makes little difference because its not over coals. Its in an oven so to speak. the heat is around it, not over or under it.
<span class="ev_code_RED">Not quite. Meat cools the heat as it rises toward the top of the smoker, but fat down is MUCH more important if cooking big cuts on the bottom rack.</span>

3 I like mustard. Its water based so won't add messy pan plus vinegar breaks down meat slightly adding to tenderness. Flavor is not boosted by it, just aides in adhering more of the rub.
<span class="ev_code_RED">Don't have a problem with the rub adhering as long as the meat's not too cold, and I doubt very seriously that the minute amount of vinegar does anything to the meat's surface.</span>

4 I have stopped using water in the pan because it slows down the cook(resulting in more time and more charcoal consumption) and isn't really needed IMO. Its already a cut meant for low and slow like most bbq. Doesn't need any more moisture.
<span class="ev_code_RED">Water doesn't slow down my brisket cooks unless I'm trying to cook over about 250*, which I prefer not to do unless foiling, in the wsm, at least. I notice a SIGNIFICANT difference in the dryness of the surface of the brisket if not using water so I'll only skip it if foiling since I get bark faster. If brisket "doesn't need any more moisture", then why is "dry" often the complaint? Water won't add moisture, but humidity has something to do with the cook and that's why foiling works so well.</span>
5 I feel like the most under rated seasonings in rubs are the "earth" type. Thyme, celery seed, thyme, celery seed, and oregano. Did I mention thyme and celery seed? Oregano is good too.
<span class="ev_code_RED">We AGREE!</span>
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Everybody's got an opinion, and that's ok. However, since you said you've not been successful at brisket on the other thread, I'd reserve any judgements about brisket cooking until you're happy with the results, particularly regarding cooking them on the wsm. Just MY two cents.
 
Thanks for the replies. I've got a packer's cut to try for first brisket cook. The butcher trimmed it for me. I'll post pic's of the cook.
 
My 2 cents:

water in the pan
250 degrees
fat cap down
wet age the brisket. I keep mine packaged in the fridge for at least a week before the cook.
I apply the rub and use a Jaccard tenderizer to push the rub down in the brisket

There are lots of good ways to do a briskie!!
 
Mike the easiest way to cook a brisket, throw all gadgets away and just cook to tender, what ever temp you want to use is fine, just cook to tender.
 
Originally posted by Alan F:
I'm waiting to hear the rest of the story...
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The rest of the story is a Great cook Alan:

The victim:

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Butcher trimmed, Not a bad deal: in these parts:

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The WSM at work with Maverick ET 732:

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End result was Great!:

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I learned a lot from my 2nd WSM cook. A tweak here and there and the Great info supplied by all the Folks here should make Smoke #3 even better!

Thanks!
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