I need help PLEASE

[bill D]

Hi all,
I know some of you all are pros so I'm hoping you all can give me some advice/ your opinions on this brine. I tryed it on a turkey for thanksgiving and don't think it went right. We saw minimal difference in the turkeys. yes we had 2 turkeys 1 brined and 1 reg just in case. heres the recipe i used, how done and other info.

Cranberry Turkey Brine
Ingredients:
4 1/2 cups filtered water
1 1/2 cups Morton kosher salt
1 cup brown sugar
1/2 cup brandy
2" fresh ginger root chopped
6 cloves garlic, peeled and lightly smashed
1 Table spoon allspice berries cracked
2 Tea spoon whole cloves
6 springs fresh thyme chopped
6 sprigs fresh rosemary chopped
6 bay leaves broke into pieces
6 sprigs fresh sage chopped
1 orange juiced and chopped
1 lemon juiced and chopped
1 apple chopped
1 onion chopped
12 cups (3 quarts) cranberry juice (2 cans frozen)
6 cup (1 1/2 quarts) apple juice (1 can frozen)
6 cup (1 1/2 quarts) orange juice (1 can frozen)
5 1/2 cups low sodium chicken stock (3- 14 Oz cans)
in a 1 qt sauce pan add 1/2 cup brandy and 1/2 cup water, add ginger, garlic, allspice, cloves, thyme, rosemary, bay leaves, sage, heat till warm (not boiling) stirring often. in a 4 qt sauce pan heat 4 cups water, add salt 1/2 cup at a time this ensures totally dissolved add sugar. allow to cool and mix the 2 pans, put in fridge for 1-2 days when ready to brine add juices orange, lemon, apple and stock to container and add the brine from fridge and stir. loosen skin on turkey and place turkey in head first, add filtered water to cover if necessary. turkey must be totally submerged. brine for about 24 hours.

Turkey was a Honeysuckel White NATURAL
Stock had 3202.5 mg sodium for the 3 cans

Sunday night i made up the saltwater and spices on let cool and placed in fridge.
Tuesday late afternoon i mixed up the juices and chilled for bought 5 hours, around 10 pm i mixed up the brine in a 5 Gal bucket lined with turkey roasting bag and 2 tall kitchen garbage bags place turkey in and tied off each bag. removed and placed in cooler with ice.
Wednesday night around 12 PM removed turkey from cooler brine was in all 3 bags go figure. rinsed and dried turkey placed herb-ed butter under skin and put in fridge to dry.
Thursday 11:00 get turkey out fridge to warm up, add 1 orange, lemon, apple, onion, few cranberry's to cavity. 11:30 fire up gas grill with hickory chips, 11:45 put turkey on, 1:00 add more chips, 2:00 added chips, 3:00 removed turkey as temps were at 158 thigh and 170 breast. 3 hours 15 min for 20 pound bird temps ranged from 325 lowest to 500 highest 500 was start of cook temps were between 350 and 400 rest of time depending on the wind and my playing with settings trying to keep it around 375.

Turkey was good just not what we were expecting from a brined and smoked turkey. had a faint hint of hickory flavor but hardly any brine flavor. One thought i have is that since the turkey roasting bag leaked as well as first trash bag that there wasnt enough liquid around the bird to brine. the liquid would have displaced the air in the bags, since i was unabel to get it all out.

Sorry for the long winded post but i wanted to include as much info as passable so i could get input on where or what went wrong here. please give me some feed back. I would also like input on your thoughts on the brine recipe its self. thanks[/size]

 

[Shawn W]

2 thoughts:

brine longer next time, assuming you used a 20lb bird, brine 24 hours next time, if you want it stronger try 30 hours next time on same size bird ... also, add up the liquid volumes and make sure you have enough salt and sugar (see All About Brining in reference topics)

brine: there is a LOT going on in there ... not saying it's bad or wrong ... just having a hard time 'tasting' that in my head ... perhaps simplify it a bit so that something stands out

 

[Shawn W]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">brine: there is a LOT going on in there ... not saying it's bad or wrong ... just having a hard time 'tasting' that in my head ... perhaps simplify it a bit so that something stands out </div></BLOCKQUOTE>To finish up that thought, flavor brining that I've done introduces a mild flavor to the meat compared to say marinating beef with soy sauce. Straight soy sauce can easily overpower the beef.

So, if the flavor is mild and really complex it might confuse your taste which is why I suggested simplifying it a bit, have something that stands out and registers.

 

[Bryan S]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Shawn W:
brine: there is a LOT going on in there ... not saying it's bad or wrong ... just having a hard time 'tasting' that in my head ... perhaps simplify it a bit so that something stands out </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Welcome Bill.

Yeah, whole lots O things going on in that. Looks like a 50 car pile up on the interstate.

I'm with Shawn here, way too many ingredients in there. Pick a theme and go with it. Yes, brine longer, 24-48 hrs. is pretty much standard for a whole Turkey. 24 hrs. being for 10-12lb. birds and up to 48 hrs. for 20+lb. birds. Many brine for 48 hrs. no matter the size, when they want a stronger flavor from the brine. HTH

 

[Tom Barineau]

We did a whole 10-12 lb. turkey and 6 lb. turkey breast using this brine recipe:

http://allrecipes.com/recipe/brined-and-roasted-whole-turkey/Detail.aspx

Brined overnight in a clean 5-gal. bucket, put the butter on more or less as directed, smoked at 225-250, and both were FANTASTIC!! You might want to try using this simple recipe and put your other "flavoring/seasoning" inside the cavity while smoking. We did not melt the butter and pour it over, nor did we use wine, broth, or water.

Oh yes, I used four chunks of pecan wood and a very small box of applewood chips which someone had given me years ago.

 

[K Kruger]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> Looks like a 50 car pile up on the interstate </div></BLOCKQUOTE>To that end, some suggestions:

Drop the following as they won't do anything for the brine (either because there is too little or they are relatively weak to start with):

the brandy, the lemon, the apple, the onion

Skip the rosemary. Make it two oranges and zest them first, adding the zest and the juice. Don't add the pith.

Don't use frozen concentrates. Use cranberry juice that says '100% juice' on the label, not 'cocktail' and use good quality apple juice or cider. Switch the orange juice to either cranberry or apple. Replace the chicken stock with apple or cranberry juice and up the salt to 1.75 cups.

Cut the sugar to .5 cup.

Do bring the spices, salt and sugar to a boil using 1 qt of one of the juices, then cover, reduce the heat, and simmer 10 min. Allow to cool, mix the brine, then chill before use.

Brine 36-48 hours.

No need to bring the turkey up to room temp (but do go with the butter under the skin, which you can do just before cooking if you'd prefer), just start the cook lower and cook the first couple or three hours in the mid-to-upper 200s which will allow more time for smoke adherence. Up the temp to 325 then, maybe 15 min before you think you'll hit done and only if needed for skin color or texture, up the temps to the 375 or so level.

 

[Tom Chips]

No point adding much else, Kevin summed it up perfectly. The only thing I'll say, is I stopped reading the ingredients list about 1/3 the way down. Too much going on there. Simplify it.