First Brisket...not very good


 
C

Chris Derum

TVWBB Member
Had my WSM about a year now and have done quite of few smokes of butts, ribs, chicken etc. This past weekend attempted my first brisket and it did not turn out very good at all. It was very dry, which makes me believe that I way overcooked it. Here's what I did any suggestions so my next attempt will be more successful is much appreciated.

Picked up a 6lb flat from my local Safeway. This could be the basis of my problems as their meat is average at best. It said is was a whole untrimmed brisket.

After pulling it from the cyrovac it seemed to be very trimmed, very little fat at all. Rubbed it up liberally with a no salt rub wrapped it up in plastic wrap and put it in the fridge overnight.

Next morning fired up the WSM using the MM and clay saucer with two fistful size of oak and one pecan. Temps were nice and steady in the 250-260 range. Put the brisket on fat side down...well what little fat it had...and I was good to go.

Had to run to my brothers house to help him a bit on his remodel and had the Mrs call me when it hit 155 internal or if any major spikes in temp. She called said it was 155, so I told my bro have fun ripping down the dry wall I have to go smoke meat. Kinda suprised me cause it got up to that temp much quicker than I thought.

Got home and I was sitting at 162, pulled it at 165 wrapped in foil put in about a cup of beef stock and back on the smoker. At this point temps seem to come up pretty quickly.

As a general gauge I was thinking 1-1.25 hrs/lb. Figured I would use 185-195 as a gauge to start testing for tenderness with a probe. Came up to 185 in four hours...hmmm...checked it with a probe and a lot of resistence.

Four and half hours in I'm at 195, for some reason I'm telling myself this is way to quick. Grate temps are steady in the 250-260 range. I test again. I've read several threads where it was said testing for tenderness a probe should go in very easily. It was still had quite of bit of resistence.

At this point I'm not sure what to do. I let it go to 198, it still had a lot of resistence. I moved the temp probe around to several different locations and all came with in a degree or two. I decide to pull and put it in a warmed cooler for a couple of hours.

Dinner time. I pull the brisket out of the cooler. Smells awesome. Looks good. I start slicing and I could tell right away it was very dry. Very nice smoke ring though, so I had that going for me, which is nice (obligatory Caddyshack reference). Sliced the whole thing and it is dry as hell all the way through. We ate some, but wasn't all that good. Lets just say the dogs had more than we did.

The Mrs says if this is what brisket is like I would prefer you stick with the butts and ribs....Ok challenge is on.
 
Chris, I just did my first brisket this weekend and was not happy with the results either. I'll be watching you post with great interest. Larry was saying that it will take a few briskets to get it figured out, so I won't throw in the towel yet. I'm sure we will get coached up pretty well before next weekend. I think "Chukky" about has me talked into trying Chuck Roll next time I want beef. Keep the faith. Later.....Chris
 
Chris,

I've done brisket with limited success - it is definitely the most challenging meat to cook IMO. Here's a good thread that you should check out if you haven't already:
http://tvwbb.infopop.cc/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/1780069052/m/6360093154

I'll defer to the experts like Kevin, but the gist is that you don't go by temps once you foil. You really need to go by feel and how easily the probe/fork goes in. I know that is sometimes easier said than done, especially when you're afraid of overcooking. Brisket will take some practice.

I believe a large contributor to your dry brisket was the lack of fat. If it didn't have a decent fat cap to begin with, I think you're fighting a big uphill battle to get it tender. If you have access to a Sam's club, I find that they have nice flats and sometimes packers. People have also had good luck with whole briskets from Wal-Mart, but I personally haven't tried one.

Anyways, keep trying. I'm doing another brisket this weekend in hopes of figuring it out.

Pat
 
I think you nailed it why the brisky wasnt tender. It was a trimmed flat which is difficult to get tender. A thick fat cap on a flat is key. I pretty much only cook whole packers which I have found more "forgiving" but of coarse challenging. I always take mine to 195 as well and have never been disappointed w/ the results. Also it could of been a low quality flat to begin with, minus the fat cap as well..your sure to be doomed.
 
My next attempt I'll start with a better piece of meat. I just grabbed the flat on a whim while at the store getting something else.

I don't have a Sam's club and my local Wally World doesn't carry meat. I'll check Costco see what they have. I do have a local butcher who carries great meat and is super knowledgable, but carries a nice price tag with it.

Working in real estate finance, which has gone in the sh*tter here in CA, I have A LOT of time on my hands to practice.
 
If I might interject, more of a question than a statement.
I'm wondering if since there was "little fat
cap" to begin with, if it would make sense to have put it on the smoker "Fatside Up" ? Any comments. John
 
Chris IMO crappy cuts of meat are benefited during a high heat cook. Most of the briskets that I've cooked are usually a low end choice or select cut.

If I had a really good quality choice or prime cut, then I would cook it low and slow. If not, then high heat....I just don't think the internal fat content is sufficient enough.

Be aware, though rare, that some cuts of meat just don't turn out well no matter what you do..
 
I doubt it. Fat of the type found in fatcaps on briskets are of a fairly firm type. Though there is some softening and rendering it is relatively minimal; moreover, it does not soak into the meat when heated.

First, Chris, check both therms for accuracy.

It is obvious from your description that you weren't cooking a 'whole untrimmed brisket'. Where I live supermarket flats are trimmed to within millimeters of their lives--no surface fat is present but, worse, they are trimmed so quickly that care is not taken during trimming. It is clear from how they look that the 'butchers' (I use the term very loosely) cut through the meat, not the base of the fatcap. This is easier to do, quicker, and the trim goes into the hopper for ground meat so they don't lose any money doing this. The flat are very even and revoltingly thin, maybe an inch to just over, from end to end. I wouldn't use them for braising let alone smoking.

The problem with thin brisket is that there just doesn't seem to be enough connective tissue/interior soft fat to counteract the moisture loss that occurs during low/slow cooking. We even see this with packers if the end of the brisket flat is significantly thin. That end will often end up dry though the rest ofthe flat is tender and moist. One of the ways you can combat this is to cook the brisket at high heat, shortening the cooking time. Still, if the flat is thin, it's a bit of an uphill battle though, imo, less so if cooking high.

Note that brisket that reads as dry can be undercooked. Judging by the times/temps you note I leaned this way at first, but it is hard to say without having seen the brisket. If in fact it was thin, it is possible it overcooked. Foiling does speed cooking.

When cooking at high heat I don't recommend using a therm after foiling because it is often the case that temps rise quickly--especially if doing a packer--because of the moisture content of the meat. This can lead 'temp-centric' cooks to believe the meat is done when it is far from it. Feel is better. Though therms can be used on low/slow cooks, even if foiling, one should start checking for doneness a little earlier if using foil, especially if cooking a flat and especially if the flat is thin.

Though I prefer high heat brisket cooks not everyone does, and brisket can certainly be cooked successfully at low/slow levels. If wanting to perfect that approach, skip the overly trimmed flats. (If that ends up being all you can get I'd either do a high heat cook, shortening the time variables and checking sooner (preferable) or, if you're set on low/slow, checking earlier for tenderness.)

See here for more on time, temp and tenderness. As noted there, many cooks use a specific temp as the target to pull and wrap the brisket for resting. But many cooks have access to better briskets too! Some still find this approach tricky anyway, at first, but will find that once they get it down they can more easily recreate the cook if they replicate the cook as closely as possible each time, and if they purchase similarly sized/shaped/marbled briskets as well. Fine, but one then really needs to start out with something more worth the bother. I strongly suggest finding better briskets, packers or at least thick, well-fatted flats. You'll be successful sooner, can try both low/slow and high heat and see what you prefer, and can then more easily shoot for replicating your approach of choice.
 
Great info guys...thank you.

Kevin, you're right, after reading your post this thing was trimmed within millimeters of its life.

Funny thing is I used to work for Safeway (local big grocery chain) in college. They had some old school guys who were butchers for years, but then they had some younger guys who were trimming meat one day and they were stocking produce the next, checking out groceries the day after that.

Lesson learned on this one, start with a better cut.
 
Above 300. I usually shoot for ~310/315 for the first part of the cook (I Minion the start but use more lit); 325-350 for the foiled phase.
 
Kevin,

How long would you cook a 5.35 lb flat with the high heat method? I do not use the Minion method, does that matter?
 
My first brisket I did half Dr BBG and Half Kevin K. I did a whole packer til it hit 165 then foiled til I thought it was fork tender. took to tail gate for football game. Oppened it up chopped and took the cup or so of sauce mixed with some bbq sauce and poured over the chunks. It was gone in a flash and it was a big slab of beef.

I did a corn beef brisket flat boiled yesterday and it never got as tender and juicy as the whole packer on the smoker. I don't claim to know what I am doing but if I listen to Keven and others it is hard to mess it up.

If it dries out add more butter and wine till it get to where you want. Just kidding but I have tried it beer works too. Good luck on your next cook.
 
'Boiled' can be a problem, especialy with cured meats. A low simmer usually works better. Good that your packer came out well!

Jen-- Nice thick flat, not too trimmed? Well--cook till it's done.
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Minion or not, not an issue. I'd temp the internal and foil in the 160s. I prefer leaving a little room around the meat and a bit of headspace above the meat but I crimp tightly closed.

Total time is going to depend on thickness of the meat and actual cooktemps--and how well the meat is marbled. I wish I could be more specific. The packers I do come in at 4 hours, sometimes to 4.5. I Minion the start (using more coals though) and boost cook temps after foiling. I would expect that yours would come in around the same time but, again, it depends on those factors. I would first check for tenderness at 3.75 hours into the cook (a little sooner if temps trended higher). I wouldn't expect 'done' yet, probably, but it will give you a good baseline feel. Check every 15-20 min thereafter unless it's starting to feel tender. If that's the case check every 7-10 tops.

If the flat is on the thin side expect to hit the 160s sooner and expect to hit tender sooner as well. If thin and overtrimmed it's a tough cook.

Hope this helps.
 
Thanks!

Its a decent looking flat, not one that looks like a London Broil. Good amount of fat cap and decent marble.

My first attempt was a big packer (13 lbs) and I did low & slow. Foil finish in the oven. It was perfect and I couldn't believe it. 2nd attempt was a flat. It was OK looking but did that one low & slow and it turned out dry.

Just read Barbie's Smoked BBQ Bean recipe and now I am debating which way to cook the flat!
 
I think packers are easier to keep moist. The few flats I have done that were good had butts over top basting it for hours. I tried the bacon on top trick and would have probably worked if about half way through the cook I would have replace the bacon with fresh.

I have only done a couple of flats. Seems like a waste to buy a flat when the same money buys a packer that weighs a few pounds more. I really hate it when that happens.
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If you don't like the point, I understand that. Most of the points I make go into either chili or hog apple beans. MMMMMMMMMMMMM

Chris, lots of good info that I don't need to add to. I was just going to say a botched brisket still will make excellent chili or hog apple beans. Is there an echo in here?
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