Burner flame questions


 
J

JimV

TVWBB All-Star
I have a few questions for u guys....... I own a Weber Genesis Silver B 3 burner as my personal grill and have been rehabbing a few curb alerts during the covid thing. I have learned a lot but still dont understand the idiosyncrasies of the burners. For my personal grill my burners were in pretty good shape w no issues but I wanted shiny new parts for my trophy grill and ordered new burners. From what I can see the new burners gave me that perfect blue flame with some orange tips. I cant remember exactly but I believe my old burners had tall orange flame. I know for certain that the grill I was just rehabbing today had tall orange flames on high.....It was daytime so hard to see if there was any blue. So here are some questions.....

Do the new burners cook better then the burners with some age on them?
Is there anything wrong with an older burner with tall orange flame vs new burner w controlled blue flame?
Ok I admit it....I took my 5" harbor freight cup brush to my rehab grills burners today...man they looked awesome afterwards...is that a no no?
Am I correct to think the taller flames are due to the burner holes opening up over time or from people brushing them?
Is it possible to adjust the flames????
Will u guys admit to wire wheeling a burner to make it shine :) ???? cmon u know u have done it
Thanks all
 
I'm not a Weber expert by any means, but I have a brand new Genesis 345 (Costco 335). It's been used 3 times, and the burners were factory installed and are untouched. They definitely show orange flame on high.
 
I wire wheel the burners on almost every rehab grill that I do. Nothing wrong with that. The flames should be mostly blue with some orange/yellow tips. They will burn orange if there is a lot of gunk on them. Sometimes, even after cleaning them, you need to let them burn for a while to let them burn off all the junk on them before they will settle down and burn correctly. You can adjust them via the shutter on the end where the valves go in them. Opening and closing those shutters will adjust the flames, but you should only do that as the last resort. Normally they will burn correct with the factory setting.
 
Lots of things contribute to flame color. Fuel mixture, burner condition i.e. dirt, cobwebs, etc, humidity, ambient temps, wind, and so on. If all the stars line up and the gods allow you will have perfect picturesque blue flames. But, that is a rare condition at best
 
Ok thanks..........so if my burners on this rehab with the knob settings on high have tall orange flames is there anything wrong with that? They wire wheeled to a very nice stainless steel shine....they look great. I am just wondering if the perfect blue w orange tip flames cook more evenly or better then these wild forest fire tall orange flames........yep I am exaggerating quite a bit.
 
Jim, can you post a photo or two later in the evening when it is getting dark outside. Then we will know exactly what you are talking about.

Here is a video I did on a grill a couple years ago. Your flames should look similar. Also, keep in mind that wind will cause the flames to burn orange/yellow as well.

 
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Tall and orange indicate incomplete or uneven combustion. I would recommend pulling the burners, rodding them through with a brush flushing them out with solvent and blowing them dry with compressed air. Something like this https://www.mcmaster.com/stainless-steel-tube-brushes/aggressive-cleaning-tube-brushes-8/ or https://www.mcmaster.com/stainless-...eaded-shank-aggressive-cleaning-tube-brushes/ If you're a shooter I think about 12 or 10 ga size shotgun brush. The burners get scale on the outside and inside. This interrupts gas flow and air flow which interferes with proper mixing of air/fuel. Another thing is to remove at least the orifices on the valves. A Weber rep gave me that tip and clean them well with a scotch brite and strong solvent and be sure the hole is cleaned. My recommendation is until you do all these things do not adjust air shutters. Bottom line they don't "unadjust" themselves so if there is a problem find the problem. Unless of course you're using a whole new set of burners than some adjustment may be necessary. BTW pay attention to the spider screens. They get lots of dust and reduce air flow
 
Good advice guys.......so this tall orange flame thing was happening with my personal grill and one of my rehabs. For my personal grill I just bought new burners and sure enough I had that beautiful blue flame. I will do some burner and valve cleaning to see if it makes a difference. If it does that would be a good trick to have up my sleeve. I have an old burner in my trash can right now.....I think Ii will retrieve it and cut it in half to see what goes on in there.
The question still stands.........Does the pretty blue flame cook any better then the tall orange flames?
Thanks guys
 
I beleive so Jim. I think once you get the colored flames (other than blue) it indicates a less efficient burning of the gas.
 
ahhhh that makes sense.....the reason I was pushing for an answer is that I just found out that my nephew officially graduated from college during this whacky covid time......no ceremony....but now I know what I am gunna do with the green top silver b that I am restoring. I already let the cat out of the bag and the kid is extremely excited about getting his first Weber. He is a gym rat and does that whole eat right and exercise thing ( to each his own :) ) but he likes to grill chicken for his healthy diet and has become quite the young chef......I cant give the boy tall orange flames......gunna have to order me a shinestar set of burners. Or maybe u recommend a diff brand....I used the shinestar in my personal grill and they burn very nicely.
 
I have found several of the aftermarket sets on Amazon to be good burners. You shouldn't be paying over $25 for them on Amazon.
 
LMichaels said:
Another thing is to remove at least the orifices on the valves. A Weber rep gave me that tip and clean them well with a scotch brite and strong solvent and be sure the hole is cleaned.
Click to expand...

I have a similar issue with a grill I've been rehabbing. Luckily I have two very similar grills in rehab right now: a Spirit E-310 and a Spirit E-320, similar ages. That means I can swap parts and identify the sources of issues. Unfortunately, it looks like the yellow flames I'm getting on the middle burner aren't from the burner, so they must be from the valve. I looked at the orifices and they appears to be solidly in place with some kind of adhesive/welding stuff. Can I remove the orifice? Or is it better to disassemble the valve and run solvent through there (and thus out the orifice)? FWIW the orifice doesn't look terrible clogged.

Attached photo of my yellow flames for good measure.
20200813_204936.jpg
 
Quite possible a simple adjustment of the venturi shutters on the middle tube and maybe even the tube to the right will fix that problem.
 
Yellow is an indication that it's running rich...not enough oxygen. Have you cleaned the spider screens on the air shutters lately? Sometimes they get dirty, like window screens.
 
The orifices can be removed and Chris has a sticky video of how to clean and lube everything. I would really clean everything on yours. Pay attention to cleaning the burner tubes well and especially the spider guard screens. I would not be messing with adjustments. They don't magically go out of adjustment by themselves
 
Bruce said:
Quite possible a simple adjustment of the venturi shutters on the middle tube and maybe even the tube to the right will fix that problem.
Click to expand...
I did try that first 😊. I'm pretty sure it's not the burner as I swapped in the middle burner from my other grill and had the same issue. Then I swapped manifolds and the issue went away. Thus I believe it's something on the manifold like the orifice, rather than the burner tubes themselves. Unfortunately I now have to re-set the venturi shutters once I get it all back in working order.

LMichaels said:
The orifices can be removed and Chris has a sticky video of how to clean and lube everything. I would really clean everything on yours. Pay attention to cleaning the burner tubes well and especially the spider guard screens. I would not be messing with adjustments. They don't magically go out of adjustment by themselves
Click to expand...
😬 too late, but good advice.

I found a youtube video on removing the orifices, and it says to use "pipe dope" sealant when re-installing. @LMichaels I did find your reply here: https://tvwbb.com/threads/how-to-lubricate-manifold-knobs.69304/post-764385, and you indicate NOT to use any sealant. My factory installed orifices do appear to have some sealant though, so I'm curious if I need to use it. I also wonder if I could have used too much grease when I reassembled the valve and that's what clogged the orifice (though I swear I only used a teeny tiny thin coating of cerami-glyde!).

[EDIT] Added link to youtube video that mentions sealant.
 
Yeah no dope on the orifices. As for people thinking every time there is a flame "issue" it's time to adjust the air shutters. Answer is no. If the grill has been fine for however many years and then the flame propagation or fuel mix appears off then figure out what changed. I can guarantee the shutters did not magically move on their own. Either burners got dirty/corroded, spider guards are full of grime (or spiders LOL), gas is leaking and or not flowing properly, etc. There are myriad reasons doing with maintenance before touching adjustments.
 
LOL. that's me Larry....Just call me the shutter guy. I am sure you are correct again. Especially since he swapped in a different burner and had the same issue.
t0sG1c6.jpg
 
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