anyone awake, cooking w/ problems, help pls.

put pork butt in a 9 last night, royal oak brand is all I had on hand, which is fine, but w/ full mounded ring, and mm light, woke up this morning and temps were 212 from a fairly steady 240 when I went to be at 10 30. As ussual (see post in temp section) damned guru did "somethin." i'm concerned w/ food saftey. read post before, of course cant find them right now. Funny part is THE RING IS ONLY burned to top of charcoal holder, that is, in other words looks pretty darn full. Last experience it was all gone after 12 hours w/ briskit. to u guys who use royal oak brand does this even seem close. Its been 9 hours later, also i think i remember 8 lb. pork butt, pretty sure give or take a pound, as of that, its a internal temp of exactly 150. this all seems to slow after 9 hours ESP. CHARCOAL. should I chuck it? what I wonder was if temps were extrememly low during the night, that ring is really full looking to me, esp. since it was gone after 12 hours w/ a briskit. btw nothing else I did was out of ordinary except new rub. thanks i'll be waiting, thank goodness for early birds like me. -Dan
edit, as of RIGHT NOW pork is intern temp, 151, sorry..

This might be a tough call – I’m not a professional and I didn’t stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

Danger zone for meat is 41-140 degrees according to several web sights I looked at. So if after 9 hours you are only in the 150’s you obviously spent a considerable amount of time in the danger zone…is this long enough to grow a sufficient amount of nasties? Perhaps. On the other hand you are cooking butts, so you will cook to internal temp of 190+ which should kill all bacteria.

It if was me….I’d likely think that it was OK….In all likelihood your smoker never fell below what it is now if it was at temp when you went to bed and is sealed tightly.

Just my 2 cents worth…..I’d be very interested in what the pro’s have to say on this. So my advice is to continue with the cook and wait for others to chime in.

I used RO a few times. Cooking length of burn time was usually around 10-12 hours.

I was new to lump back then though.

Others on this board have reported up to/around 16 hours of burn time. But I don't know how your elevation factor applies to this.

I think you are fine to continue, as my experience has been that once a fire goes out, it stays out until a remedy is provided. Not saying it's not impossible though.

Good luck.

thanks for quick response, I too looked at websites only so far. seems like I remember posts on here that said other things. I'm no pro either, but had successful cooks before stringing extension cords through cat door etc. gettin all technical... this this of mine may end up for sale, or money back if I havn't had it to long, i've tried several different things w/ it. but your saying that your sure (regards to charcoal amounts still there and internal temp after 9 hours of 151) that it was low during the night? did I read your take right, sir? thank you -dan

edit: sorry craig, I was typin, but my burn time so far was 9 hours, and the ring is up to top, looks like i just filled it w/ out mounding...hmmm. i'll keep an eye out thank you guys much

Your pork will be fine considering your finishing temps.

Have you tried stirring the coals? I have had lump burn through the bottom, leaving the top coals unburnt and it looks like the ring is full until I gave it a stir and the bottom dropped out. A full load of Royal Oak will last 12 hours easily as long as it's not really windy or sub zero cold.

well, stirred a while ago, seemed solid to me, this is strange. I'll just keep on keepin on i guess, still thinkin what the heck happened...

Dan what is the "ramp" set on? If it is on turn it off.

Larry is right about the coals. Ater 9 or 10 hours I tap on the bottom of the kettle several times near all of the vents. Once you do that you will see the temps start climbing back up rapidly.

no ramp, just a pitminder, 10 cfm. I think i'm good to go for now, wont be a pitminder owner anymore though. Strike 8 or 9 and your out. (i'm just bitter thank you all for your help very much. -Dan

Dan, IMHO you're meat is going to be fine. I just checked the graph on my last butt cook (8.5 lb) just to see how long it took me to get to 150 and I didn't hit 150 until the 11:30 mark.
In terms of your burn pattern it doesn't surprise me that it's burning top down if you placed your lit on the top of your unlit to start your MM.

Just curious, are you using the clay saucer or going with the dry pan?

EDIT: Just read your latest post regarding "wont be a pitminder owner" and realized who you were (having issues a few weeks ago with your pit minder) and I'm curious if you're using the clay saucer that I recommended and where your top vents are set. It does seem strange that you're using an ATC device and your bouncing from 212 to 240. You write, well, stirred a while ago, seemed solid to me, this is strange." So you stirred and you're still experiencing temp issues?

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Danger zone for meat is 41-140 degrees according to several web sights I looked at. So if after 9 hours you are only in the 150’s you obviously spent a considerable amount of time in the danger zone…is this long enough to grow a sufficient amount of nasties? Perhaps. On the other hand you are cooking butts, so you will cook to internal temp of 190+ which should kill all bacteria. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>The top of the danger zone is actually 130 but you won't see that on 'official' sites, especially those that are consumer oriented.

If the butt is intact (i.e., not boneless) I wouldn't be all that concerned with internal temps. Irrespective of what you read elsewhere, the odds of bacterial growth inside an intact red meat cut are vanishingly small. (This is not the case for poultry or for meats that are not intact--ground meat, meat loaves, boned roasts, etc.) It is more the surface of the roast that is the concern as that is where growth is likely to occur.

Vegetative pathogens would have been handled when the surface temps of the roast started to exceed 130. Ditto, were any pathogens pushed into the interior of the meat via a knife (when boning) or a probe (at the beginning of the cook).

The two pathogens I'd be most concerned with here are B. cereus (a possibility in the rub ingredients) and C. perfrigens (a possibility on the meat). Both are spore-formers, meaning that when the conditions are right and enough vegetative growth has occured they will form toxigenic spores. The spores from C. perf are not very heat resistant but the spores from B. cereus are. Common cooking temps will not destroy them. That said, I do not see how vegetative growth sufficient enough to cause spore formation was likely in the scenario you described.

The other toxigen of concern, S. aureus, produces a heat resistant toxin that survives cooking temps. It needs to grow significantly in order to produce toxins. It is a poor competitor with spoilage organisms that were likely present on the meat's surface. And, as is likely, the surface temps of the meat hit pasteurization soon enough. S. aureus is often implicated in food illnesses that occur due to contamination and temp abuse after cooking. Cooked foods that are handled (think pulled pork, chicken for chicken salad, etc.) after cooking (especially while still hot) are often contaminated with S. aureus due to the handling--a large number of people naturally carry the organism on their skin so a touch or a cough or sneeze will do it. Failure to cool the food quickly then allows for significant vegetative growth which allows for toxin formation. These toxins will not be destroyed when the food is reheated--even if reheated to high temps. This is why I repeatedly advise to cool food quickly. Packing hot or warm pulled pork into containers thickly is not the way to go. It can take a long time for the meat in the middle of a packed container to cool.

So, I don't see a food safety problem with your cook and the above is why.

By your report Dan the cooker temp was well over 140F all night. That's just fine for a solid piece of meat like a butt.

The surface of the meat that has been exposed to air and may have gotten bacteria on it is what we are concerned with being over 140F.

If you had put in a 10lb meatloaf and were reporting those temps that would be a whole different matter. All of the ground meat had the chance to become contaminated and the inside of the meatloaf would become a perfect breeding ground for the bacteria.

As for the charcoal use was it a really calm night (no wind)? Perhaps if there was little to no wind and the guru you had optimal fuel usage.

wow Kevin 2 days in a row ... lol

Really!

thanks guys, shawn I felt the same, the only bother w/ my blood is chicken. kevin, thanks. As for Larry, you've been assisting me quite well, the only thing I can say to you is I wish we were neighbors so you could see this, thats all I know how to say it, im cursed! I had a pot base and it got used, long story short, i havn't even came close to posting all the "wierd" stuff, but man o man I give up, hang on to your equipment, your charts you showed me look great. I'll post more after the big dinner tonight and thanks for hangin out talkin temp. control w/ me..post there later maybe, gotta go for now