Would like to circle back to a previously asked question regarding painting the Genesis hood sides and cook box

[JimV]

Hello all......I thought I was cured of Weberitiveitis but it appears the sickness lives within ...I took a little break but still couldnt stop checking the classified ads daily......and if u do that u eventually get back in the game. I have only completed a few nice resto's of Silver Bs but that seems to be my zone......I like the ones that have fold up treys on both sides. Anyway I screwed up my first resto by wire wheeling the hood sides and cook box until it was free of grease but at the same time chipped some factory paint off then prepped and painted and as u know it looks like crap when U do that. I eventually stripped it all the way down to bare aluminum and it turned out good but I could still see fine scratches through the paint. After that fail the next one I added texture with textured paint....Rustoleum but not high heat.....I did a light coat of high heat....followed by a light coat of textured paint.....followed by 2 light coats of high heat and done. In the end the textured stuff bubbled up when heated .......We discussed this a bit during my first resto and someone said just degrease and paint it...the paint will stick! Well I am ready to do that method. My thoughts are soft brush with some Dawn to remove the heavy stuff.....possibly followed by a spray down of brake cleaner..........After the brake cleaner is it ready to paint???? Or do I need to rub down with 99% alcohol? Are you saying even if the cook box looks a lil funky yet has been cleaned the high heat will stick and not bubble?

What if I am doing a grill where the paint has chipped in a few places??? Those areas will certainly be shiny.....and I dont do flat paint. If I strip all of the paint off how do I avoid the deep scratches? I couldnt strip the OEM paint with a wire wheel on a grinder I had to use a flap disc and it picked up globs of paint and made scratches but sure as heck removed the paint and fast!

Thanks all

 

[Timothy F. Lewis]

I think the problem is the non high heat simply is not designed for that no matter what you spray over the top, the base is not heat tolerant, it’s going to fail.
Grind all that down to bare metal, clean with alcohol or xylol allow to dry, then paint with the high heat paint. If you want a semi gloss sheen there is a Rustoleum for that as well as the regular flat.
As in any painting project surface preparation is critical to get a good finish. I skipped a couple of spots when I did mine and I’m just going to go back and re do the project. Lesson learned. The good thing is I can swap end caps with a spare grill after I get one set repainted properly then, redo the ones on my “Working” Genesis. That way, I’m ahead on the second restoration.
If I’m wrong I know someone will correct me, Bruce, Larry, Jon, Stefan?

 

[LMichaels]

Only use high heat paint. Yes if the base paint is solid, any kind of clean evaporating, free of water and residue solvent will do the trick. So yes brake cleaner falls into that category. Plus it will (as will things like Prep Sol and so on) leave a slightly "etched" surface of the base paint and the new will adhere better

 

[JimV]

Ok I will clean with soft brush and some Dawn....rinse that off very well.......then spray exterior with brake cleaner........and then paint.......then cross fingers
I just scored a big old school blue top.....I dont even know what it is yet but I will be doing a slow tinker resto on that one.......I want the paint to be perfect. I think its a 2000 series...it has wood slats and the side burner....pics soon

 

[Timothy F. Lewis]

Only use high heat paint. Yes if the base paint is solid, any kind of clean evaporating, free of water and residue solvent will do the trick. So yes brake cleaner falls into that category. Plus it will (as will things like Prep Sol and so on) leave a slightly "etched" surface of the base paint and the new will adhere better

Larry, the non high heat paint will continue to deteriorate if he does not remove all of that with a cup brush won’t it? I would think good paint over bad is simply a waste of time and money get the surface right before, a soft brush and dish soap won’t be enough to get a true surface will it?

 

[LMichaels]

Larry, the non high heat paint will continue to deteriorate if he does not remove all of that with a cup brush won’t it? I would think good paint over bad is simply a waste of time and money get the surface right before, a soft brush and dish soap won’t be enough to get a true surface will it?

Yes it will. I assumed he would realize that. Maybe I am wrong because then after all the instruction about WATER I see this "Ok I will clean with soft brush and some Dawn....rinse that off very well.. "
So I guess nothing sinks in

 

[Timothy F. Lewis]

I calls ‘em, like I see’s ‘em.
Thanks for the clarification, I’d hate to see Jim waste his time with a second paint job when doing it right won’t take much longer.

 

[JimV]

I heard u guys...........if u go back and read my original post I was talking about multiple grills that I have worked on. The paint sandwich was recommended to me here on this site so I gave it a try. When the individual was asked how it held up he said I dont know I sold the grill. So I tried it and it did not work out...but have since sold that grill.
My over all question that my post was about is when u get a grill in the shop.....what is the absolute proven method to prep the painted surfaces and get a professional looking finish. I see many photos that do not show the painted surfaces close because you know the areas where the paint was chipped off can still be seen. The options as I discussed in my original post are strip to bare aluminum.....in which I asked how to avoid scratches when doing so.....................or prep and paint over it........which I mentioned the chipped areas will show up as shiny and not look good at all...........
For some reason u guys locked in on the one statement I made about the textured paint.
I am working on a completely different grill now.....forget about the paint sandwich...............I said I will clean with dawn and rinse with WATER.......... ......but I will then prep with brake cleaner.....then paint..............................
Sorry for the rebuttal but the I guess thinks just dont sink in thing........was a bit off.......

 

[LMichaels]

Not really. Dish soap and water have no point being used in the process. Prepping metal for paint should always be done with a no water environment. Water/moisture is the bane of solvent based paints. No matter how good you think you've dried something once it's been wet unless you can "bake it off" you will have future issues with paint (unless of course you're using water based paints i.e. latex). So again no soap, no water. Clean solvents (no residue) only should be used.

 

[Timothy F. Lewis]

There are a lot of “finished” pictures after sandblasting or wirecup brush with an an angle grinder, they are smooth and often smoother than, the original finish.
The better method to avoid damaging the enamel on hoods is to simply disassemble them, if it’s not in the way, you CANNOT chip the lid. That was the first tip I got from this forum, easy enough to put back together after the paint has cured out.
Paint sandwich can work out just fine as long as you use high heat paint for BOTH layers.
Not yelling, just emphasizing the important points.

 

[Jon Tofte]

For my limited part, the idea of “sandwiching” texture paint between layers of high heat primer and high heat paint was admittedly very experimental. I did it for a Q grill I gave my sister, and she hasn’t mentioned any issues. But she just may not notice. The other, a Silver A, was sold so as mentioned I don’t know the outcome.

I hope to try again on a personal use grill and see how it goes. I will report accordingly. As Larry points out, proper preparation of any painted surface is critical. Of course, ANY grill paint job with available spray paint, no matter how well applied, is not going to last indefinitely. The stress of heating and cooling and grease, smoke, etc. is going to do it in eventually.

 

[JimV]

LM
The second round really explained what you were trying to get across. Thanks for info it will help a lot. Sometimes when I first get a grill I will want it to just look better so I might spray it w 409 or whatever cleaner is around......but I get what you are saying ...keep the end caps and cook box free of any water based stuff.......use the prep stuff or brake cleaner.
As for my sandwhich thing.......the textured paint I used looked like it literally had sand in it.......it came out looking awesome but like I said it did bubble up. I only used it extremely light...and only in the areas that were chipped down to bare metal. I will try to enclose a pic.....the grill turned out great.
Some grills come in with the side of the cook box and the end caps covered in grease? I am just finding it hard to believe that if I just spray that ugliness with prep spray or brake cleaner that the high heat will stick to it. If its a grill with nasty stuff on the outside of the cook box and end caps should I just go for the wire wheel even though I might chip the oem finish and deal with the consequences vs trying to paint over dried grease goo? Pics coming up

 

[JimV]

here are some pics of the Silver B.......yes I installed a handle screw

 

[JimV]

a few more

 

[JimV]

Last one.........I mean Im not a complete boob...........I am just asking these questions to get my finished product looking like what you guys are putting out there. I have seen some awesome restos on this site.......mind blowing!

 

[Jon Tofte]

Hey Jim,
You should never feel bad about asking questions. That’s what this forum is about, and truth be told, there is no one here who doesn’t have something to learn. I would say your grill is looking really good. I love cast iron, even if it is a pain to take care of, so I especially like what you have there.

I am sorry my “sandwich” paint idea didn’t work out for you. In answer to your question, while I am not a paint expert (obviously), I would say that you are right that you have to get the surface totally clean. I think Larry’s comments assumed that was a given. For me, I would try really hard to do that with chemicals and save the oem textured finish. But if you can’t or it is already damaged, then yeah, you need to strip off ALL of it and go with a “smooth” look. We have seen many here done that way that look spectacular. It is just a different look and one that quite a few actually like better.

 

[LMichaels]

Jim
Yeah do keep in mind on the initial cleaning water based cleaners are inevitable. I do the same. I will usually just hit everything with something like EZOff and the power washer. But when it comes to paint prep itself nothing that is water based or hydroscopic. One good thing about using high strength isopropyl alcohol is it is able to be a co-solvent for any water or condensation. But I wouls still follow it up with something like prep-sol or lacquer thinner/enamel reducer.

 

[Timothy F. Lewis]

Yeah Jim, I’m not trying to be a jerk, I think your end product looks great. And I’m jealous of your new blueberry!
(I think that’s a 3000)

 

[JimV]

Thanks for the valuable info guys........looks like all the players chimed in and I appreciate that. Hey Jon absolutely no apology needed regarding the paint sandwich didnt mean to set u up there......I am no spring chicken....I knew what I was getting into.....its a free grill...a hobby.....something to tinker and learn on......I was in it to try something different and I will eventually figure out how to add texture to dem shiny bits.
Fortunately my new blue topper is not chipped anywhere so I should have a real nice lookin paint job on that one. Another area that has baffled me that should be so darn simple.......I have had a hard time getting paint to adhere and lay down nice and pretty on my frames. I have tried everything........steel wool........primer first.......99.9% isopropal alcohol.....I used the 2x spray suggested...I used the high heat around the cook box.....but it seems like what LM was talking about.....like I am not getting the water based crap off the frame even with the methods that I used. Next I will try a real paint prep product and see if that improves adhesion. I mean I shouldnt have to stress about painting a dang grill frame thats supposed to be the easy part!!!

 

[Timothy F. Lewis]

The things that are supposed to be easy always end up taking extra time! And headache! A four week kitchen remodel is going on it’s 6th month! Getting people to do what they are supposed to do when they are supposed to do it has been very difficult through all this pandemic! But, the counters will be in I hope shortly after I return from a little escape to the northern part of the state so, I’m not going to complain about it. I just want it over!