Advice Needed for Outdoor Kitchen Design


 
J

JayT

TVWBB Member
We are re-doing our patio and it is a good time to put in an outdoor kitchen. Nothing fancy here, just want to put up a retaining wall about standing height and leave in space for the WSM and 22" Kettle. I am thinking of putting it against the house wall, like in the photo below. Would that be a problem with heat, smoke or anything else?


wall grill.jpg
 
I have a good friend who's pulling the trigger on a similar project. Don't forget to leave room for getting to the bottom vents on the WSM and access for taking the middle section off so you can clean out the ash. If you plan to use a stoker fan (see other forums) then access to the bottom vents is of less concern.

If your exterior wall is brick, there are less fire safety concerns. If you have vinyl siding, I'd say having grills next to the house is a bad idea. With bricks, a grease fire can blacken your bricks, but should come off with a power washer. With vinyl, there's potential to melt it, and create a terrible mess and a greater risk of catching your house on fire.

Good luck with the project, and share pics with us all when you're done!
 
Oddly enough, I am not one that really wants to look at a wall when working outside. I’d build the kitchen facing outward. My set up is more like a galley style kitchen, heat facing the driveway, herb garden and working space next to the house.
I can put a cooler under the workspace so everything can be easily grabbed.
 
I second not putting it against the wall. It makes it harder to interact with company and probably poses a greater fire risk. We put in an L-shaped island with a drop-in charcoal grill. a LP side burner, and an empty area at the end of the island for another cooker (WSM, Genesis, camp stove for wok). The other cookers rotate through that area as needed. Our location and design carries some risk, but it did not violate any codes because it is not attached to the structure of the house.

IMG_3728.JPG

Running water and a sewage hookup substantially drive up the cost of an outdoor kitchen. Unless the planned location of your outdoor kitchen is a long schlep from your indoor kitchen, I don't think it is worth the money, particularly if you live in a cold climate and pipe freezing is an issue. As for a refrigerator, we had one initially. It was a cheap dorm-room style. We did not spend the money for an outdoor-rated unit. I'm glad we didn't. We got rid of it after a few years and replaced it with more storage. A fridge runs 24/7, and even the energy efficient ones use quite a bit of juice. As much as we were entertaining back then, it still wasn't worth it. A tub of ice on a table works as well or better than a small fridge. I would also skip the side burner. Everyone told us to. No one ever uses them. I used it once or twice. Keep it simple. You need room for your cooker(s), work/serving space, storage, electrical outlets and lighting. Really think about electrical and storage. If you use an ATC or rotisserie (or may in the future) plan your outlets and storage accordingly (the roti ring for kettle and roti rods take up a lot of room).
 
J Grotz said:
Our location and design carries some risk, but it did not violate any codes because it is not attached to the structure of the house.
Click to expand...
Ah, the C-word...Jay, are there any building codes you have to deal with?

I don't have an outdoor kitchen/cookstation, but I definitely like the idea of a detached unit better if only for better access to the components. And in place of a fixed side burner, a portable induction cooktop could be used.
 
Brad Olson said:
Ah, the C-word...Jay, are there any building codes you have to deal with?

I don't have an outdoor kitchen/cookstation, but I definitely like the idea of a detached unit better if only for better access to the components. And in place of a fixed side burner, a portable induction cooktop could be used.
Click to expand...

I inquired to the city building inspector at the time. As long as it was not part of the structure of the house and it did not involve electrical, plumbing, or gas lines, no codes came into play. The island is not attached to the house. There's no plumbing. There's an LP tank drawer for the side burner. Electrical was a finer line in terms of codes. There was an outlet on the outside of the house. An electrician checked the circuit of that outlet for load; there was another outdoor outlet on it. He installed some outlets into the island and the island plugs into the outlet on the outside of the house. 13 years in, we haven't had any electrical issues.

Of course times have changed and every jurisdiction is different.
 
Also, think about whether or not you want your cookers built in to the island. Our stainless drop-in charcoal grill is now 13 years old. The charcoal bed inside raises and lowers. That mechanism will not last too many more years. The company that made the grill no longer makes parts. Newer drop-in charcoal units are different sizes. I had a Performer before we got the island and thought about having it built in. If I were doing it over, I would get a simple L-shaped island with no grill or side burner built in, but a little bigger area at the end for stand alone cookers. That way I could have whatever cooker I wanted, even a pellet cooker.
 
Put me down for wanting a fridge at the outdoor kitchen, not sure where folks think all fridges use lots of power but any more it just aint so, https://www.kompulsa.com/refrigerator-power-consumption-deciphering-the-label/ , your typical dorm style unit you find in a lot of outdoor kitchens don't use much juice at all if you keep them full during the hot part of the summer, and if you can chill the stuff before you put it in there. the smallest fridge in the link is 3 times bigger than a dorm style and I would put 1 in instead of the dorm size if I had room, I would design the sink next to the house so water could be ran without a worry about freezing, keep the fire away from any walls or windows as a wind shift will move the heat over and melt stuff
 
Outdoor grilling area vs an outdoor kitchen is two different things. The OP mentioned an outdoor kitchen, but he only wants to do a grill, smoker setup, so I wouldn't call that a kitchen unless you add a sink, fridge and a kegerator.
I like my grilling area, but in the Midwest adding an outdoor kitchen to me is a waste of money, because you can only use it for 5-6 months vs a warmer climate where you can use it year round.
And don't get me started on peeps using pavers in the midwest, another waste of money.

Tim
 
MikeCantell said:
Put me down for wanting a fridge at the outdoor kitchen, not sure where folks think all fridges use lots of power but any more it just aint so, ...
Click to expand...

I would never put anyone down for wanting anything. You are correct that fridges have become more energy efficient. The issue for me lied not with the energy efficiency of the fridge, but that the fridge was only getting used 1-2 times a month, while running 24/7; that's just wasteful on several levels.
 
J Grotz said:
I second not putting it against the wall. It makes it harder to interact with company and probably poses a greater fire risk. We put in an L-shaped island with a drop-in charcoal grill. a LP side burner, and an empty area at the end of the island for another cooker (WSM, Genesis, camp stove for wok). The other cookers rotate through that area as needed. Our location and design carries some risk, but it did not violate any codes because it is not attached to the structure of the house.

View attachment 6300

Running water and a sewage hookup substantially drive up the cost of an outdoor kitchen. Unless the planned location of your outdoor kitchen is a long schlep from your indoor kitchen, I don't think it is worth the money, particularly if you live in a cold climate and pipe freezing is an issue. As for a refrigerator, we had one initially. It was a cheap dorm-room style. We did not spend the money for an outdoor-rated unit. I'm glad we didn't. We got rid of it after a few years and replaced it with more storage. A fridge runs 24/7, and even the energy efficient ones use quite a bit of juice. As much as we were entertaining back then, it still wasn't worth it. A tub of ice on a table works as well or better than a small fridge. I would also skip the side burner. Everyone told us to. No one ever uses them. I used it once or twice. Keep it simple. You need room for your cooker(s), work/serving space, storage, electrical outlets and lighting. Really think about electrical and storage. If you use an ATC or rotisserie (or may in the future) plan your outlets and storage accordingly (the roti ring for kettle and roti rods take up a lot of room).
Click to expand...
Thanks for the feedback!
 
Brad Olson said:
Ah, the C-word...Jay, are there any building codes you have to deal with?

I don't have an outdoor kitchen/cookstation, but I definitely like the idea of a detached unit better if only for better access to the components. And in place of a fixed side burner, a portable induction cooktop could be used.
Click to expand...
Ah! I need to check that now :) Thanks for the reminder, folks!
 
timothy said:
Outdoor grilling area vs an outdoor kitchen is two different things. The OP mentioned an outdoor kitchen, but he only wants to do a grill, smoker setup, so I wouldn't call that a kitchen unless you add a sink, fridge and a kegerator.
I like my grilling area, but in the Midwest adding an outdoor kitchen to me is a waste of money, because you can only use it for 5-6 months vs a warmer climate where you can use it year round.
And don't get me started on peeps using pavers in the midwest, another waste of money.

Tim
Click to expand...
Tim, you are correct - I only need an organized outdoor grilling, with a standing wall and surface and storage space. No plumbing or gas required. I will be doing electric work for the lights though.
 
Timothy F. Lewis said:
I don’t have room for a full kitchen! But, I’d try to figure out someplace for a kegerator!
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timothy said:
Outdoor grilling area vs an outdoor kitchen is two different things. The OP mentioned an outdoor kitchen, but he only wants to do a grill, smoker setup, so I wouldn't call that a kitchen unless you add a sink, fridge and a kegerator.
I like my grilling area, but in the Midwest adding an outdoor kitchen to me is a waste of money, because you can only use it for 5-6 months vs a warmer climate where you can use it year round.
And don't get me started on peeps using pavers in the midwest, another waste of money.

Tim
Click to expand...
Tim, what's wrong with using pavers in the midwest? I am currently deciding between pavers and concrete.
 
timothy said:
Outdoor grilling area vs an outdoor kitchen is two different things. The OP mentioned an outdoor kitchen, but he only wants to do a grill, smoker setup, so I wouldn't call that a kitchen unless you add a sink, fridge and a kegerator.
I like my grilling area, but in the Midwest adding an outdoor kitchen to me is a waste of money, because you can only use it for 5-6 months vs a warmer climate where you can use it year round.
And don't get me started on peeps using pavers in the midwest, another waste of money.

Tim
Click to expand...
Mmmmmm kegerator. I will have one someday :cool:
 
JayT said:
Tim, what's wrong with using pavers in the midwest? I am currently deciding between pavers and concrete.
Click to expand...
Well done pavers are awesome. Our patio is stamped concrete that looks a little like natural stone. In this pic you can see my dogs are doing a good job of holding it down. I don't think we paid a lot extra for the stamping, we went for no coloring. According to our contractor colored concrete is a bit of a crapshoot, so you can look at photos and even other peoples patios all you want you don't know exactly how it will look until your patio is dry. I'm debating a power wash for mine right now. it looks a bit more natural when its dirty like this. I might wait a while longer (until wifey complains 😁)IMG-2561.jpg
 
Timothy, what’s wrong with pavers? I have laid a patio using them and they have not gone anywhere they have cost me a few glasses but they don’t bite my feet or cause any problems.
 
40+ years I seen a lot of paver jobs and prolly 95% have had issues. Builders I worked for wouldn't offer you one if you wanted a patio, concrete yes but if you wanted a paver one you waited a year (Until your warranty was up) and subbed it yourself.
Even the commercial jobs downtown they are redoing them every 3-4 years, and they have a snow/ice melt system installed.
Which is strange cause the old cobblestone/paver streets lasted over a hundred years.
Seems the more tricked out ones have more issues then a simple paver patio on grade.

Tim
 
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