I just ordered a stand mixer

I wanted to get one of these several years ago and finally did it. I went with the Kitchenaid pro 600 in Nickle Pearl....... hard choices!

I got it mainly for bread - I'm not a huge baker but I've made probably 2-300 loaves over the last several years, and I've not been so happy with my results lately (a super-simple 100% whole wheat). The last few times I've made it I've skipped the bread machine & kneaded it on the counter & used bread pans & cooked in the oven. Kneading for 20 minutes..........yah I don't think so

There's a whole wheat (think it's 40/60 ww/white) and a 7 grain loaf (prolly try this first) in the Cooks illustrated Baking book....I've been buying a lot of e-cookbooks from ATC & Cooks Illustrated lately.

I hope I use it and that it's convenient.

Good choice Clint, we have basically the same model only Barbs is 30 + years old and still works perfectly. Until recently she did up to 100 dozen Christmas cookies with it every year plus all kinds of other things too. We recently got the pasta attachment and the meat grinder attachment both work really well with it.

I got stuff to make oatmeal raisin cookies ----- dunno if I'll do them tonight (full of soup now)

That's the unit Clint! Need the hp to fight through the dough. I like my 800 watt universal (can mix 3 loaves + ) BUT I can only mix 3 loaves [minimum with it. Hope it works out for you.

Clint, have you looked into: Artisan Bread in 5 Minutes a Day? It can't get any easier than that and you will have enough dough for several days and you don't even need a mixer; however, you do need some refrigerator space.

I've been playing with their breads for a while. I've made a few of their basic breads and found them quite good. I'm getting ready to try a couple of the 100% whole-wheat pan loaves but it might be some time before I can get that done. I've been familiar with the technique for a few years before their books have come out....they also have a book about Pizza. Be advised that they have a revised and updated version of their first book, which you'll see on the website.

Rita

Rita Y said:

Clint, have you looked into: Artisan Bread in 5 Minutes a Day? It can't get any easier than that and you will have enough dough for several days and you don't even need a mixer.

I've been playing with their breads for a while. I've made a few of their basic breads and found them quite good. I'm getting ready to try a couple of the 100% whole-wheat pan loaves but it might be some time before I can get that done. I've been familiar with the technique for a few years before their books have come out....they also have a book about Pizza. Be advised that they have a revised and updated version of their first book, which you'll see on the website.

Rita

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There's some good looking stuff on that site! My plans are simple.....I just want a whole wheat sandwich bread to start with. I read a bunch of stuff on making baguettes, but one of my favorite local grocers makes such good baguettes for so cheap, I don't think I'll bother! (this store's baguettes are crispy/really nice crusts, not like the bread sticks some stores sell...and for $1.69 - they'll even slice it for you if you ask )

I have a question for you or Len or whoever else might know: will this loaf fail for any reason that you're aware of if I sub almond milk in place of whole milk? I only buy cream for recipes, & half & half for coffee every now & then. I might even try it with just water........ just wondering... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I have never subbed almond for cow milk Clint. It'll be a lot sweeter than cow milk and using all that honey, I wouldn't sub almond: I'd use cow.

I rarely if ever use milk now as it gives a much softer crumb and a very soft crust. I prefer only water as it gives a crispy crust.

Milk will be good for a softer crust (not crisp at all) and more tender crumb. Good for sandwichs but little "chew" if you know what I mean. It's nice but not my preference.

1)That "bread" flour: use can use A.P. without a noticeable difference.

Keep in mind, that is not a "whole wheat" recipe in the sense you may think. It's only 60% whole wheat.

Thanks for the input - I'll try it as written & then with just water. I was almost afraid to try the sub.

Hey, I just googled and they sell unsweetened almond milk. I've only had sweetened version so figured it was the only kind. Assumptions, you know.

Go with a straight sub but watch the time. It may be done a bit sooner than the recipe suggests.

Clint, first, you won't see most of the recipes from the books on the their site for obvious reasons. You might check out their books at your library or their Indices at Amazon to see what they contain. I know that they have at least 2 everyday 100% whole-wheat sandwich breads and some that are a combo of whole-wheat and bread flour.

My favorite whole-wheat flour to use is King Arthur WHITE Whole-Wheat flour, which loses the bitterness of regular (dark) whole-heat, has a natural sweetness, and produces a lighter-colored crumb that appeals more to kids. The nutrition is the same for both and it can be used interchangeably with regular whole-wheat flour, so no conversion is necessary.

I've never tried subbing almond milk for whole milk in breads. Milk has a tenderizing effect on the crust and crumb and will contribute to a texture that most of us think of as a sandwich bread. Maybe it is a result of the calcium in regular milk or not, I'm not sure. Maybe use part cream and part water? Just a thought. You might try freezing milk in the portions you'd need for the bread. It will thaw, but won't constitute as smooth as fresh milk, but it can be used in bread recipes (buttermilk can be used the same way). Of course if there is a dairy intolerance, you'd have to go with the almond milk and see how it works.

You might find some helpful information in the search "substituting almond milk in recipes"

You'll be developing a nice layer of flavor with that overnight sponge. It also will contribute to the keeping qualities of the bread.

Hopefully another breadhead will jump in with thoughts on the almond milk substitution, but if you do make a successful substitution, I'd love to hear about it.

Rita

Len, good advice. I had to take a break while working on my reply and posted it before seeing yours.

You mention your stores "baguettes". If you make it at home, it won't have the preservatives they ultimately put in it to give it shelf life. You won't believe how much better your's will taste. Trust me on this one.

Also, USE UNBLEACHED FLOUR!!! Much much healthier for you. But you need to actually look on the label to verify it is in fact unbleached. I've only found one flour up here that doesn't use bleach.

If it has azodicarbonamide (say it, rolls nicely off the tongue) in it, it is bleached, regardless of what the label says.

I've read there is "white whole wheat flour". It's a lighter coloured wheat than the "regular" kind. I've never used store-bought whole wheat flour (I grind my own grain!) so don't know just what is in store-bought stuff.

I only use wheat and/or rye and/or spelt grain. I do use store bought white unbleached flour in about a 60% white (60-40) mix as I find using 100% w.w. (ground grain) just too much oh-i-don't-know "wheat" flavour. 100 % comes out too heavy for me as well. Not quite what you want in a sandwich bread.

Makes fantastic toast-with-peanut butter though

Bleaching depends on the label AND depends on state laws as to whether it's required to be listed. I know that azod... is banned in Europe and Australia. It's allowed in Canada as well as the U.S.

However, azodi ("ADA") is also used in this manner:

Yes, ADA is also authorized for use as a blowing agent in sealing caps for food containers such as ketchup bottles. In 2005, the European Food Safety Authority (EFSA) assessed the risk from the use of ADA as a blowing agent and concluded that it is not of concern for human health given the levels that have been found in foods packaged in glass jars and bottles. However, EFSA had also noted that exposure to SEM should be limited where possible, and the European Union banned this use of ADA

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and from WiKi:

The yoga mat chemical

An example of the use of azodicarbonamide as a blowing agent is found in the manufacture of vinyl (PVC) foam, where it plays a role in the formation of air "bubbles" by breaking down into gas at high temperature. Vinyl foam is springy and does not slip on smooth surfaces. It is useful for carpet underlay and floor mats. Commercial yoga mats made of vinyl foam have been available since the 1980s; the first mats were cut from carpet underlay.[10] In 2014, azodicarbonamide drew attention as the yoga mat chemical, because the compound is used both as a food additive and as a plastic blowing agent. Amid public discomfort with the dual uses of azodicarbonamide, the sandwich franchise Subway announced that it would no longer use it as a dough conditioner.[11]

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No thanks.

Sorry about the series of posts. I tend to ramble when I believe in something.

Now sign up for Bed Bath and Beyond to get a 20% off online purchase and get one of these.

http://www.bedbathandbeyond.com/sto...ence-set/1014480099?Keyword=kitchen+aid+pasta

Len, I see that Clint is in Utah and you're in Ontario and might not have access to the following products, or perhaps they have different names in Canada.

White whole wheat flour (really whole white-wheat flour) is a true whole-wheat flour, complete with the bran, endosperm and germ, only it is milled from a different strain of wheat (white spring wheat rather than red winter wheat), and is nutritionally the same, but not as bitter and a pinch sweeter than that milled from red winter wheat. King Arthur (located in Vermont) is one of the favorite and most-trusted brands in the U.S.; Bob’s Red Mill, another excellent company is a close second but might not be quite as available here in the States. King Arthur flours are, in the last couple of years, now widely available in grocery stores here in the U.S. and the only flour I buy. I used to grind my own flour but found I couldn’t get it as finely ground as the commercial flour, which, in my opinion and experience, contributes to a lighter, less grainy, and less "whole-wheaty" flavored loaf. Maybe my mill was at fault; who knows?

Here is some information you might find interesting from the King Arthur website. (Disclaimer: I have no association with either Bob’s Red Mill or King Arthur except as a very pleased consumer.)

• WHITE WHOLE WHEAT FLOUR (Protein is 13%, regular whole wheat is 14%)
Want to add the fiber and nutrition of 100% whole wheat flour to your baking—without the strong flavor and dark color traditionally associated with whole wheat flour? White whole wheat flour is the answer.

The mild flavor and light color of white whole wheat make it perfect for all kinds of cookies, heartier cakes, bars, muffins, scones, and lighter, milder whole wheat bread. Substitute it for some or all of the all-purpose flour in many of your favorite recipes.

WHY YOU'LL LOVE OUR WHITE WHOLE WHEAT FLOUR
Milled from 100% USA-grown hard WHITE spring wheat
Protein: 13.0%

This flour, America's #1 white whole wheat flour, starts with lighter-colored, milder-flavored white wheat, rather than traditional red wheat. But don't worry; it still has all the fiber and nutrition of traditional whole wheat. Substituting white whole wheat for all-purpose flour in recipes yields a treat that's just as tasty as the original, with the benefits of increased fiber, vitamins, and minerals.

Our organic white whole wheat flour, top-seller in its class nationwide, is grown using certified organic farming methods.

Their Unbleached All-Purpose Flour (also available as organic, as are most of their products) is also excellent and I use their whole wheat pastry flour too, which has a lower protein/gluten count, successfully for things such as muffins, quick breads, pancakes, waffles, and such.

King Arthur and Bob's have more types of flour and meals available than anyone else I’ve found. I wish they had been around when I started baking bread!

Len said: "Sorry about the series of posts. I tend to ramble when I believe in something."
.....Yeah, me too! As you can see! - Rita

Your last post just arrived. I'll save that for tomorrow so I won't put anyone else to sleep besides myself!

Rita

Have to make sure you read the label. I know that one of our "President's Choice Unbleached Flour" brands has the azodi... listed on the label. They are a major supermarket chain across Canada so I called their customer service line and asked why they claim it's unbleached yet use azodi..

Customer rep came back with "it's not a bleaching agent. It's a dough conditioner". I asked him to check with their product division as it is a bleaching agent. Amazingly, they called me back 3 days later, agreed it was as I said and didn't know why. He seemed genuinely upset about it.


AFAIK, they still make the same product with the same ingredients. Neither a bleaching agent (because people like "white" flour nor a dough conditioner (who knows why) is required to make bread.

Re: K.A. unbleached white w.w. flour. That's where I found the reference Rita (online). Not sold here. Same caution applies though: read the label.

My point to all of this is, you have to read the label. Not all is at it appears. If it's not stated on the label (unbleached version), call the customer service line and ask them if they use azodi...

Clint said:

I got stuff to make oatmeal raisin cookies ----- dunno if I'll do them tonight (full of soup now)

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If you get babysitting duties again, don't serve anything "raisin" cookies, you'll be off the cool list so quick and it'll be tough to get back on

Way cool mixer

Len, it's good that you contacted the company. To look on the bright side, if more people would do that, but many are not as experienced and well-informed as you are to notice the details. Good for you. Enough to make a company change its formula? Maybe, if enough people would respond as you did so that they will see that they re losing business because of the quality (or lack thereof) of their product. Maybe you could have a discussion with their head baker about this. He/She should be conversant about the chemical makeup of each of their flours.

Rita

Initial contact/ follow up was good on their part. They seem to be a responsive company in that regard. Don't know how far "up the line" it goes though. Nice idea though and I might just follow up on that.

Wonder where Clint went ?

I'm lurking Just picked up / reading another ebook on breads.....

My Pizza: The Easy No-Knead Way to Make Spectacular Pizza at Home

>>>edit: I've also watched a video on rebuilding the gear case on youtube, and a couple other reviews....

Rich Dahl said:

Good choice Clint, we have basically the same model only Barbs is 30 + years old and still works perfectly. Until recently she did up to 100 dozen Christmas cookies with it every year plus all kinds of other things too. We recently got the pasta attachment and the meat grinder attachment both work really well with it.

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I also got one of these more than 30 years ago and it's still running strong. These things are built like a tank! We also have the meat grinder and juicer attachments and they work great. We're confident the mixer will end up with our daughter when we can no longer use it. Who knows? It may outlast her too!